Possible AoS Side Advantage

[MrGrim]

I was reading this blog where the author analyzed whether or not specific sides had an inherent advantage regardless of player skill in 2 mobas, LoL and Dota2.

 

In Dota2 the map is fairly balanced with radiant having a slight advantage and the longer a game goes dire has a slight advantage, possibly due to roshan.

 

In LoL however the 'blue' side has a significant statistical advantage in nearly every game mode. LoL's map might be so skewed because of the camera angle thoery. The reasoning of it is that the dota map is pretty asymmetrical with each side having an advantage/disadvantage and while LoL's map might be asymmetrical its not as much so as dotas so it's not enough to overcome the disadvantageous camera angle.

 

My reason for bringing this up is wondering if the AoS map also has a side advantage to protoss. The map is pretty much as symmetrical as can be and levi isn't as important as roshan. Additionally aeon is pretty easy for toss to get and is attainable much more early. The much later daggoth buff might not be as significant as the gold/exp that aeon gives so early. All this points to toss having a pretty clear advantage.

 

What are your guy's thoughts? And is there any info available to prove/disprove?

[MOTHER]

I'm not sure if it's nicer or if it's more advantageous but I always felt that Protoss hard lane is more fun and easier to handle than Zerg Hard lane. Maybe it's the camera angle...

Edited March 22, 2014 by Jessika

[EterNity]

The map is always favor Protoss due to the location of Aeon.

 

You usually get 4 Aeon in an In House and probably 1 Levi in most of the cases.

 

This has been discussed and will stay the same way since our developers have bigger project to do.

[Indo]

I'm not sure if it's nicer or if it's more advantageous but I always felt that Protoss hard lane is more fun and easier to handle than Zerg Hard lane. Maybe it's the camera angle...

 

it is..

 

also protoss got an advantage of ganking aeon due to terrain and warding levi midgame and vice versa for zerg warding aeon early and ganking levi later on

[MOTHER]

Hypothetically speaking, would people be in favor of moving Aeon and Levi to the opposite corners of the map (where the firebat creeps are) and curving the b/t lanes more inwards towards the river? It would require a fair bit of terrain redesigning but it would open up the river area even more, creating a larger jungle area. Also by centralizing the boss creeps at the meeting point of both t and b lanes, they become even more of a warzone than before which is always fun.

Edited March 22, 2014 by Jessika

[EterNity]

The idea was suggested several times and long before you even start playing. It was not accepted.

[MOTHER]

Was there a reason given for its refusal when this was suggested several times and long ago before I even started playing, EterNity?

[EterNity]

Yeah, the idea basically got Redhydra'd ignored without responds.

[Moo]

I know that the camera angle affects things. When on Zerg side, penthos can blink from inside the base to the top Thor camp, while on Zerg side I have not been able to. Perhaps this is just me derping, but I think camara angle does make certain places have larger distances required for blinking.

[SayMyName]

In dota dire have advantage due to roshan. Its not "slight advantage". Its just advantage. To understand this you would need to play high ranked games or watch more and listen more to professional enviroment.

 

But it can mean nothing if You dont capitalize it (mostly proper composition, draft according to taking roshan). You can also prevent stuff like that with taking towers (its mostly tower - travel advantage to rosh pit), having strong composition for rosh pit, proper warding, rotation, ganks etc.

 

I dont understand your theory of "radiant early slight advantage".

 

For what reason are you writting? Cause of being bored? If You write something be sure its correct at least (your making statements and writting like putting facts instead of "i heard that in dota" when You are not correct. Thats my why I am posting this)

 

 

In AoS Protoss have advantage due to Aeon (high ground / travel distance from base and towers). Levi is important but timing of Levi was moved further with its buffs (harder to take Levi).

 

Aeon gives You early game and snowball (early game advantage). Mostly in strategy if you have advantage early, dont fu..k up and capitalize it you have stronger mid and with midgame stronger late and you can win the game.

 

Still knowing about it You can prevent it by having proper composition with strong timings for aeon, proper warding, map control, movement and also putting lanes according to that.

 

You can also make and play other strategies that can negate and bypass aeon early advantage. But its too much to write.

 

 

Its not gamebreaking.

 

 

Its like in chess white are starting. Some people saying they have advantage. But later it doesnt matter much.

 

You need to have some stuff in mind and play by it. Its strategy.

 

Not everything is "fair and the same in life" especially in strategy. Otherwise it would be boring.

[Indo]

I know that the camera angle affects things. When on Zerg side, penthos can blink from inside the base to the top Thor camp, while on Zerg side I have not been able to. Perhaps this is just me derping, but I think camara angle does make certain places have larger distances required for blinking.

 

this just doesn't make sense and has nothing to do with the angle of view but rather of a slightly higher distance, if it would be the angle of view you should be able to jump there once you changed it by 45° but you can't

[MrGrim]

In dota dire have advantage due to roshan. Its not "slight advantage". Its just advantage. To understand this you would need to play high ranked games or watch more and listen more to professional enviroment.

 

But it can mean nothing if You dont capitalize it (mostly proper composition, draft according to taking roshan). You can also prevent stuff like that with taking towers (its mostly tower - travel advantage to rosh pit), having strong composition for rosh pit, proper warding, rotation, ganks etc.

 

I dont understand your theory of "radiant early slight advantage".

 

For what reason are you writting? Cause of being bored? If You write something be sure its correct at least (your making statements and writting like putting facts instead of "i heard that in dota" when You are not correct. Thats my why I am posting this)

 

 

In AoS Protoss have advantage due to Aeon (high ground / travel distance from base and towers). Levi is important but timing of Levi was moved further with its buffs (harder to take Levi).

 

Aeon gives You early game and snowball (early game advantage). Mostly in strategy if you have advantage early, dont fu..k up and capitalize it you have stronger mid and with midgame stronger late and you can win the game.

 

Still knowing about it You can prevent it by having proper composition with strong timings for aeon, proper warding, map control, movement and also putting lanes according to that.

 

You can also make and play other strategies that can negate and bypass aeon early advantage. But its too much to write.

 

 

Its not gamebreaking.

 

 

Its like in chess white are starting. Some people saying they have advantage. But later it doesnt matter much.

 

You need to have some stuff in mind and play by it. Its strategy.

 

Not everything is "fair and the same in life" especially in strategy. Otherwise it would be boring.

 

I'm not sure if it's entirely a language problem where your grasp of English is slipping and that might attribute to your extremely volatile attitude in your prose or you might have had a momentary lapse of judgment but you should re read what I wrote and read the link I link before commenting especially if the comment itself is a page of drivel.

 

In the link there are statistics linked that are more important to your own personal convictions or your asinine understanding of the game. The statistics say that early game (15-30 mins) radiant has a higher win rate. Mid (30-45) radiant still do but it isn't as prominent, and late (45+) dire have a better win rate.

 

When you think I say "radiant early slight advantage" this is what was said. Its a pretty retarded understanding if you think that dire have a flat advantage especially when there are facts to prove the contrary. I guess I should have made it more clear if you couldn't understand or read the link. What I wrote was a summary of stats so how are you arguing against the stats of the game?

 

My reason for writing (again there might be a problem reading if you can't read the last sentence) is to ask whether or not AoS also have similar statistics. I didn't say that they actually do, I didn't say to change anything I asked if there are statistics present. First you must identify the problem then you can fix and having the relevant information helps. Also dota is my favorite game to watch, pro streams and tournament streams but that doesn't change the facts and stats so I don't know how that would help anything unless to inflate an ego.

 

In dota the map has been changed, pull camps removed rosh being tougher, timer being random, in response to the stats and then interpretation of the game. In a perfect world we would have win rates of aos tournaments, ih and pubs where you can make an argument based off that but right now its pretty useless since its just hyperbole.

 

In the future please carefully read before posting since it can be a waste of time to help people understand something thats all ready clearly stated.

Edited March 22, 2014 by MrGrim

[Moo]

 

 

this just doesn't make sense and has nothing to do with the angle of view but rather of a slightly higher distance, if it would be the angle of view you should be able to jump there once you changed it by 45° but you can't

I didn't know you could change the angle of the camera, how do you do this? Also, as a clarification, I'm talking about the mirrored sides. So I can blink from inside base to the Thor camp at top with penthos on Zerg side, but on Protoss side I cannot blink from inside base to the Thor camp at bot.

[iatebambi]

I remember being able to flip the camera around. Can that still be done?

[BestZeratul]

In dota radiant has much better lanes than dire so it's actually balanced. I think radiant has higher winrate than dire in the last couple patches.

[MrGrim]

 

 

 

Overall winrate is 50 to 49 so overall it's balanced but in different times one side does get favored more than the other.

 

In LoL the winrate for blue is 55% for all game modes including aram which is a pretty large discrepancy.

[Hogwarts]

Was there a reason given for its refusal when this was suggested several times and long ago before I even started playing, EterNity?

 

Same reason the base size has not been increased.