How do you guys feel about Siege Creeps.

[Hogwarts]

I think there a little strong. To strong. I think they have to much range and the deal to much damage.

 

At the first spawn "5th wave" they deal 110 Damage. At this point in the game your only going to have 600-800 life. Depending. Taking 3 shots this early greatly reduces your lane presence exponentially. I find it more difficult as melee heroes. Every time the thing comes the lane becomes stale. Worse yet they can stick around for a while. Even worse is you can push them back with two heroes stacking them into the next creep wave. Lord Z can ring it also and pulling it back. Its massive so half the skills in the game dont work on it.

 

I mean lets look at its class. Its considered a Massive Unit. The same class at Levi and Aeon. The reason for this is solely so Marine King cant ult it. Because its a utterly strong unit. This says leaps and bounds about the unit it self.

 

I think this unit promotes boring game play because there simply just so powerful. If im playing a dps hero in the jungle. And there is a siege creep I wont even bother ganking that lane. Iv learned my lesson by going in and just dieing to the creep wave as the hero im ganking runs away and uses no spells on me.

 

Also as a melee hero I feel your forced to get the armor and health talent. If you dont you just lose your lane. You can not poke your opponent without take taking more damage then your dealing to these monsters. And its all but unavoidable the range on those just seem ridiculous. And it all ready seems melee heroes are at a disadvantage in AOS generally speaking.

 

Also there is a bug where if you deal damage to a hero and the Siege Creep targets you. And you cloak or burrow. The Siege Creep will target you with out a true sight present. And it will remained focused on you until you escape its range. Iv died playing bio to this by using the double pop. Where you burrow and wait to pop so you can re burrow instantly poking a hero and or damaging a creep wave in a safe manner. But as i said the creep only attacks you if you damage a hero. I would image if you took lets say Super Heated Mantle on unix and burrowed into a lane and passively dealt damage to an enemy the siege creep would focus you there also with out a true sight ward or scans etc...

 

I think the range and the damage on these beast needs to be reduced and immediately. All they do is promote stale game play. If Red or Eco is worried about the creeps being useless for towers and pushing. You can take the LOL approach and have towers deal less damage to the Siege Creeps. I.e having the siege creeps have some sort of unique passive that makes them more resistant to True Damage. It shouldn't be to hard to code. But im pretty ignorant to the editor. Or you could make the siege creeps deal a bonus % vs structures.

 

Every time one of these things come to your lane its like having an extra hero in your lane.

[zeeeend]

LOL you need 2 heroes to push it back ? I can solo push it.

 

Btw we need to refer to them as bosscreeps as they are so powerfull it would be a understatement to just call em "siege"

[SourDiesel]

I actually kind of like the dynamic they've added to the laning phase. It allows weaker heroes to venture out under cover of the seige creep, and forces gankers to actually think about their timing rather than just running in whenever they feel like it.

 

That being said, the range on them is ridiculous - that's the only thing I would change. IMO, they should be strong enough to allow for weak heroes to use them as defensive cover, but not so strong that they can produce a kill all by themselves. The key to this is the range, it allows weak heroes to sit underneath them for protection and allows gankers to easily manage and time an escape.

[Gwolla]

You get used to it, but yea it sucks.

[Hogwarts]

I actually kind of like the dynamic they've added to the laning phase. It allows weaker heroes to venture out under cover of the seige creep, and forces gankers to actually think about their timing rather than just running in whenever they feel like it.

 

That being said, the range on them is ridiculous - that's the only thing I would change. IMO, they should be strong enough to allow for weak heroes to use them as defensive cover, but not so strong that they can produce a kill all by themselves. The key to this is the range, it allows weak heroes to sit underneath them for protection and allows gankers to easily manage and time an escape.

 

While i agree they can be a decent crutch. I just feel there way to strong as they stand. Normaly a weaker hero in early game has a really strong late game. So having a weaker hero struggle early and need a lane partner or a hero to support them is better imo. AOS doesn't have any real support heroes. Other then Medic.

[CrazySoldier]

They are stupid and do to much damage, have to much health, and give to little money.

[Hogwarts]

They are stupid and do to much damage, have to much health, and give to little money.

 

Thanks. I understand now.

[MOTHER]

I stopped seeing them as siege creeps or even boss creeps a while ago and figured that they are really mobile towers. I grew to like them and the dynamic and danger they introduce to the laning phase.

 

Having said this I do believe they need a nerf on their range more than anything else. The high damage is acceptable since it is a "mobile tower" but the siege range is too much.

 

Either keep the damage but nerf the range or nerf the over all damage (but grant it bonus damage against structures,) keeping the range the same.

Edited January 7, 2014 by Jessika

[Yaldi]

Half their damage and give them double damage vs towers. Then they can be called siege creeps. Or just remove them.

[jamescossey]

I think the carriers should spawn 5 intercepters and as the game goes on spawn up to 10, having 200 health at the start. starting damage 10 at 1.5 sec attack speed maxing out at 1 attack speed late game. swarm guardian should do the single target attack that blows up into a slim that does x amount of damage over 3 seconds.

[Hogwarts]

I think the carriers should spawn 5 intercepters and as the game goes on spawn up to 10, having 200 health at the start. starting damage 10 at 1.5 sec attack speed maxing out at 1 attack speed late game. swarm guardian should do the single target attack that blows up into a slim that does x amount of damage over 3 seconds.

I disagree, The mechanics of the creep need to be the exact same on both sides

[ginosaji]

I disagree, The mechanics of the creep need to be the exact same on both sides

Yea, they need to be the same... I honestly don't mind the mechanic aside from the cloak/burrow targeting issue. I like that the waves are diverse. I think they could use a nerf though, the early game damage is too high.

[John]

My best guess is that the siege creeps are there to make sure you don't zone out that poor guy who's alone in hard lane.. It's a way to secure that the weak benefits of having a guy in the jungle doesn't become a huge disadvantage for ur team.

 

As Qudditch said, this benefits range heroes more than melee heroes as you can still harass as a range hero, while as melee hero you get shap on if u try playing similiar, but then again melee heroes are already at such a big advantage against a range hero...

 

Soloution:

Buff the siege creeps or send them in more frequently ( every wave or maybe 2 creeps at the same time)

 

 

Edit: Also I think this poll should include buffing siege creeps as it brings up a more fair view on what the community really thinks about them.

Edited January 9, 2014 by John

[Hogwarts]

Yea, they need to be the same... I honestly don't mind the mechanic aside from the cloak/burrow targeting issue. I like that the waves are diverse. I think they could use a nerf though, the early game damage is too high.

 

Well from what i understand. The ciege creeps were only a place holder until the HOTS patch. Eco was talking about making 2 units.

 

1. A Protoss warp prism that should spawn micro zlots with timed life.

2. A Swarm host. that would spawn micro brood lings or some king of zerg unit with timed life.

 

And that big unit it self would not deal any actual damage. The longer the unit is in "battle" the more dangerous it will be because the amount of summons would exist. But this was a while ago and im not sure if Eco still has the ambition to see this threw. But i really liked the idea. There isnt a single other moba that does this that im aware of. I think it would be a pretty neat mechanic.

 

It will change the meta. Heroes like LZ could no longer solo lanes. Giving your other lanes an advantage. Plus a free jungle. If you wanted a solo lane you would need to draft a hero with some AOE. MY point is you wont be able to have your cake and eat it to. The second they put LZ in the solo long lane im going to kill there siege creep asap and push the tower. and watch lz struggle vs all the micro units and normal creep wave

[ginosaji]

My best guess is that the siege creeps are there to make sure you don't zone out that poor guy who's alone in hard lane.. It's a way to secure that the weak benefits of having a guy in the jungle doesn't become a huge disadvantage for ur team.

 

As Qudditch said, this benefits range heroes more than melee heroes as you can still harass as a range hero, while as melee hero you get shap on if u try playing similiar, but then again melee heroes are already at such a big advantage against a range hero...

 

Soloution:

Buff the siege creeps or send them in more frequently ( every wave or maybe 2 creeps at the same time)

 

 

Edit: Also I think this poll should include buffing siege creeps as it brings up a more fair view on what the community really thinks about them.

 

So the siege creep helps a Generic Carry+Generic support easy lane beat a Generic melee support/tank hard lane (LZ, etc.)

 

This actually does put the team that put a melee hero in hard lane at a disadvantage if they haven't planned correctly, as they'll have to get support from mid or jungle semi-frequently if the enemy easy lane has any push at all. Why is that necessarily a bad thing?

[John]

So the siege creep helps a Generic Carry+Generic support easy lane beat a Generic melee support/tank hard lane (LZ, etc.)

 

This actually does put the team that put a melee hero in hard lane at a disadvantage if they haven't planned correctly, as they'll have to get support from mid or jungle semi-frequently if the enemy easy lane has any push at all. Why is that necessarily a bad thing?

I wasn't serious in my previous post but

 

1) The siege creeps pretty much makes it safe for a solo hero to get xp the sige creep wave comes.

 

2) The other waves you should be able to zone out the melee heroes from xp range. ( before the siege creep was implemented you could punish your opponents for putting a "retarded" hero in long lane.

 

3) Since you can't really zone them out when a siege creep is near they'll get xp that wave, Yeah you can still harass the melee hard lane hero if he goes for last hits but if he just stays around the siege creep for xp there's not much you can do about it, as his new laning partner has both more health and damage than you.

 

4) The siege creeps makes it easier for a hard lane hero to not get shut down completely, so basically it promotes the already most rewarding thing you can do in the game aka jungle.

[ginosaji]

I wasn't serious in my previous post but

 

1) The siege creeps pretty much makes it safe for a solo hero to get xp the sige creep wave comes.

 

2) The other waves you should be able to zone out the melee heroes from xp range. ( before the siege creep was implemented you could punish your opponents for putting a "retarded" hero in long lane.

 

3) Since you can't really zone them out when a siege creep is near they'll get xp that wave, Yeah you can still harass the melee hard lane hero if he goes for last hits but if he just stays around the siege creep for xp there's not much you can do about it, as his new laning partner has both more health and damage than you.

 

4) The siege creeps makes it easier for a hard lane hero to not get shut down completely, so basically it promotes the already most rewarding thing you can do in the game aka jungle.

 

I understood the sarcasm... I was just disagreeing with you. I was saying that if you put a weak laner in solo long, it favors the opposiing team even more because they can abuse the siege creep even more. This means the jungle or mid has to come support that lane unless you want to lose it pretty early on.