Cyprus ulti - change it back pls?

[Anax]

I know Cyprus is a hero that has been regarded by general community as "hero for noobs", "1-click/skill hero" etc.

 

However I always found the hero quite fun and occasionally viable in inhouse games. If nothing he was a threat to carries going glasscannon early on (crit nova, darpa, ghost, etc.. but since everyone (carries) would then build tanky dps he would drop mid-late game significantly (unless he was so far ahead). A good wall also provided some cc...

 

Yes, there was the super quick CD on blink which combined with warpshard and CD reduction meant you were probably getting away EZ... but that was recently increased. I salute THAT change.

 

But apart from having a Q-W-R combo, helped with yamato and SFG, he wasn't much of a threat. A tazer/stun usually meant he melts in next 2 seconds gg no re.

 

Now - how can we make sure nobody picks the hero again? let's put a channel on his ulti. Just in case he manages to ambush an enemy AA carry, let the carry have time to activate stunknife/ TS (which is the fashion nowadays- don't leave home without it), and send cyprus back to pool. Or, let the enemy just get out of range.

 

I believe it should be changed back. The only caster that could 1-shot any AA hero gets a 0,5 sec casting time on his (most of time) only weapon. It's a difference between darpa jumping away or not, or activating a TS for example.

[zeeeend]

Change it to 0.5-0.3-0.1 channel and its fine.

I never liked the instant cast because it was just to strong for >2k dmg

[Hogwarts]

Change it to 0.5-0.3-0.1 channel and its fine.

I never liked the instant cast because it was just to strong for >2k dmg

 

you must love sunflair gun then who doesn't want 1k dmg instantly on an active?

[ginosaji]

I disagree, the whole issue is that AAs are now a hard counter to cypress, which is pretty ironic. I play AGI heroes more than INT and seldom play cyprus, but I really think this nerf absolutely killed him. Every single AGI carry and some STR carries/semi-carries with go stun knife. When I'm wandering around as an AA I always have my finger on the hotkey for stun knife as it's a good first option in both defensive and offensive postures for most heroes that use it. Instead of fearing a Cyprus when I see one, I just laugh and think "sweet some good food."

 

Even with 0.3 channel time he would be nearly useless. So he'd have to wait until level 16 to be viable. By that time, 30-50% of games have been decided.

 

He was strong because he did too much damage early game. He could almost one shot squishies forcing them to go spell resist first or feed. This was especially true with flare gun first builds. At level 6 and flare, cyprus could one shot any INT/AGI. Most people, including the devs, think flare is OP for the cost, but we are waiting on that solution still. That was part of the problem.

 

Solution: nerf level 6 base damage by 50-100 and balance flare gun.

[Anax]

I disagree, the whole issue is that AAs are now a hard counter to cypress,

 

I am not sure with what you disagree with? My post or something below? :D

[barwick]

Wait a minute, you all are complaining that Cyprus can't just solo snipe people with less than 3000 HP anywhere on the map he happens to find them.... and are complaining that he now has to actually play WITH his team, stay behind the tanks, and use his ult from back there?

 

Yeah, poor Cyprus....

[Figgonson]

Is it more effective to use w before or after you ulti? I always assumed that after the ulti would be better because you hit him with all the pillars...

[thomulf]

Before, the pillars have to be there for the ulti to deal damage with them...]

 

@barwick, right, like many AA carries can't deal similar solo burst and way better sustained damage with more tank capabilities

[ChoJo]

I agree with ginosaji

[Doom]

Awww poor cyprus.....

 

I for one love seeing him suffer. It's like the time bio was nerfed from OPness into almost complete shap in v5... except cyprus is still capable of oneshotting anything on the map, minus a few heroes that can get spell resist to 80% or so. 0.5 second cast time is only fair on a non-skillshot, long-medium range spell that deals the most damage in the game to a single target. Positioning is actually now important on him, you have a less than 90% chance of getting a kill if you just walk up to a target the obvious route. Keep him this way pls.

[ginosaji]

I am not sure with what you disagree with? My post or something below? :D

 

Sorry, I meant that in relation to Zeeend's post, keeping him with a cast time, but having it related to level.

 

Awww poor cyprus.....

 

I for one love seeing him suffer. It's like the time bio was nerfed from OPness into almost complete shap in v5... except cyprus is still capable of oneshotting anything on the map, minus a few heroes that can get spell resist to 80% or so. 0.5 second cast time is only fair on a non-skillshot, long-medium range spell that deals the most damage in the game to a single target. Positioning is actually now important on him, you have a less than 90% chance of getting a kill if you just walk up to a target the obvious route. Keep him this way pls.

 

The entire point of the hero is one shotting a squishy. He should be able to one shot someone below a certain percentage HP. The point isn't to one shot from full HP, especially early in the game like he was before. Ganker's and nuker's are exploitable in pubs, simply because of their nature of the game. Ling is just as exploitable, its just that he has a higher skill threshold. Same goes for zera.

 

He just can't perform his job the way he is now.

 

Edit: What percentage of HP should his burst be able to do? I don't know maybe like 70% or something, as he has to be relatively close. Compare it to Raynor's Ult, which can one shot squishies with around 40% of their health if your mark is on them and that's at just incredible ranges... granted you can block it/there are other counters.

[EterNity]

Cyprus is fine. The reason people think he's weak now is due to the fact that even a monkey can play Cyprus before as long as you teach the monkey how to click R on a keyboard.

 

IMO, he is still on the strong side.

[Etd]

No Cyprus isn't fine.. He is a hunter killer and he can't kill ****ing anything anymore thanks to the channel. He is was super Nerfed instead of lowering his lvl 1 and 2 dmg. I agree there Should be a channeling time but it's wayyyyyyyyyyyy to long now.

[MOTHER]

The thing is Cyprus has a skill set designed for one thing and one thing only, to exterminate systemically a single target - it is implied that this target is a high value target like a carry - If Cyprus can't do what he is designed to do effectively, then he is useless. A damage nerf would've been better.

[Doom]

The entire point of the hero is one shotting a squishy. He should be able to one shot someone below a certain percentage HP. The point isn't to one shot from full HP, especially early in the game like he was before. Ganker's and nuker's are exploitable in pubs, simply because of their nature of the game. Ling is just as exploitable, its just that he has a higher skill threshold. Same goes for zera.

 

He just can't perform his job the way he is now.

 

 

Cyprus was OP. Zera and ling still are. Cyprus can snipe anything other than perhaps a drake or tychus (heroes that he shouldn't be going after anyways). So what, yes, you might need a TPI a bit earlier than before, I don't see any problems with him, really. How is he not able to perform his job? Show me a replay where cyprus repeatedly fails because of that cast time (other than against a pro who uses lockbox/taser THAT fast, and therefore outskills the cyprus, and deserves the kill).

 

If a cyprus player uses his brain, and the terrain properly, he should have 0 problems.

[pchacker]

I'm probably a bit biased since I don't play that much cyprus, but imo it just means that your positioning when you get your combo off has to be decent now, whereas before you could pretty much just run (or blink) up to your victim and bam they were dead, but now you have to think about where they are likely to go during the short channel time so they dont get away.

[Etd]

People who blink in and just use R aren't an issue. They water the potential damage of chorus' alt. the nerf severely effects the ability to combo. Q,w, r takes time. The 0.5s is to much. If someone can't silence Cyprus now while he is combining along with a 0.5 second channel they are bad... 0.5s is to long.

[Ironsights]

Cyprus was indeed OP. before, he appeared on screen and something died, then he was gone. poof. Was bloody annoying, unless you happened to be a tank.

 

Now, he appears, you have a half second to save yourself, something dies...seems better than before.

 

is it possible the .5 seconds is too long? Maybe. I don't think so, but I have been wrong before.

 

In short: the nerf could be reduced, but not back to insta-cast.

[Skydie]

Cyprus hasn't been OP in a long time, stop this crying. Carries aren't meant to be free roaming willy nilly, want to know the solution countering Cyprus? Stay behind your fracking tank and tankier heroes, who should have taser/stuns/silences.

[Anax]

Barwick, you mention about cyprus standing behind team in a teamfight.. I can only wonder if you ever played cyprus, specially in "inhouse" environment? Cyprus needs to get "down and dirty" in order to get a kill. He's not a cow / raynor / dustin /maar that have super-long-range on their spells / ulties and rape from way behind. Yes he could kill heroes but he usually needed to expose himself. His ulti range is by no means long.. medium at best.

Regarding casting time it's almost comparable with drake's ulti (which is generally ez to counter).. except drake can ulti while heroes are being plucked so they cant counter it.. and drake has tons of HP/spellresist.. and would otherwise be superOP (drake's ulti)..

 

So yes, regarding damage, damage is still there (a cyprus combo with GE, SFG and yamato can do roughly 6 - 7k dmg before resist kicks in (maybe more)), only thing is you're not dishing it out, but dieing instead. I can relate to the fact that in pubs he was a menace. Against a mediocre team you could easily go 20-0 or so and never get caught.. But in inh even before the nerf it was seldom picked.

[ginosaji]

Cyprus was OP. Zera and ling still are. Cyprus can snipe anything other than perhaps a drake or tychus (heroes that he shouldn't be going after anyways). So what, yes, you might need a TPI a bit earlier than before, I don't see any problems with him, really. How is he not able to perform his job? Show me a replay where cyprus repeatedly fails because of that cast time (other than against a pro who uses lockbox/taser THAT fast, and therefore outskills the cyprus, and deserves the kill).

 

If a cyprus player uses his brain, and the terrain properly, he should have 0 problems.

 

Yes he's decently viable in pubs, but then again, so is anything because people are generally bad. He was used infrequently in IH games before, now he is never picked. The cast time is significant and allows for counters, although you seem to disagree. Anyone playing an AA hero will constantly be ready to stun knife at a moments notice and almost every AGI hero goes stun knife first anyway. Stun knife is the hardest counter in the game to cyprus atm and AAs are supposed to be his primary target, how does that work?

 

Zera and Ling are not op. They get fed in pubs because of the nature of their mechanics and people are too bad to play against them. Even then, the skill threshold to play either hero is high nough that noobs can't use them to 1A their way to victory and a 20-0 k/d.

 

Other heroes can easily get fed/snowball in pubs as well. It's so easy to go 20-0 with vergil in pubs it's not funny. It's super easy to do very well with Rancor and Raynor in pubs as well because of Raynor's range and the fact that flare is so good in pubs on Rancor and he can snowball early with it. Same thing with Unix, a decent player will just feed off the worst player once or twice and get ahead, ganking solo heroes from there on. With his Ult ticking faster than Parallax, you can't counter it unless you have tazer and scans/TS. Should we nerf all of those heroes back into oblivion simply because people aren't smart enough to counter them and the nature of pub games makes it so that ganking heroes do well because they feed off the bads?

[Doom]

Ok, let me suggest something then. Give cyprus constant debuff imunity while casting it. Stun knife will no longer work, but anything under 4 K hp is not flobed if cyprus sees them, and is in blink + ult range.

[Indo]

that wouldn't make it imba vs taser either xD it basically would grant 100% succes and 'd be just as good as instant

[ginosaji]

that wouldn't make it imba vs taser either xD it basically would grant 100% succes and 'd be just as good as instant

 

It would definitely be worse than instant cast. Darpa can jump, Nova E, Leo can save his E, Zera can planar, vergil blink, etc, etc. On top of that you have Vibranium/Galactic. Galactic is the most standard item for AAs to get against a spell nuker, so it would be great.

 

This might actually be a decent way to work around the issues at hand. I still think an instant cast is fine though.

[Indo]

0.5 seconds at current gamespeed is pretty much nothing though.. and if he attacks surprisingly neither stunbutton nor any silence would help against this..