Sunflare op

[pchacker]

I think sunflare should be changed back to a current hp scaling, as how it currently stands it seems a bit strong imo.

 

Discuss.

[Moo]

I completely agree, it scales super hard and you can get a flare gun at level 3, which allows for huge burst potential that early into the game with certain characters.

[Wrath]

It just needs a maximum damage value.

[Moo]

It just needs a maximum damage value.

This would help, but it feels like it is just putting a band-aid on the problem to me.

[Moo]

Energy scaling is a bit too high. Same with energy sabre(or sword, forgot) Cause u can just get like 5 int items and 1 energy sabre on rancor and u have 400+ weapon dmg per hit and 500+ int

Yeah, both items are pretty dumb late game.

[EterNity]

If an item is useful on almost all hero, it is strong.

 

The way to approach the item balancing is easy if you can completely eliminate the statement above on all items.

[atomheartman]

I dont think its too strong. early game it deals about 220-250dmg. lategame agi/str heroes - 500-600dmg. late game int - 1000-1500dmg.

[atomheartman]

u havent added gravity edge's true dmg

and spell resist.

[Mus]

 

and spell resist.

 

Factoring in spell resist is stupid. It varies from target to target with no discrernible pattern. When comparing the damage output of items or spells it's smarter to ignore damage resist altogether and just compare the raw damage output because to factor in spell resist you will basically multiply all the damage outputs that you are comparing by a constant, thus preserving their order so you don't gain any information.

[Spooky]

Sunflare Gun do little bit too much damage, beside that its fine. More concerns I have about Flare Gun, which is very cheap item and u can get it after first 2-3 creep waves. That additional spell damage at that stage of the game is taking huge part of HP away which allowes some heroes to one-shot enemies with their abilities. I strongly suggesting to increase price into sth around 1.8k minerals or remove energy scaling from that item

[Moo]

Sunflare Gun do little bit too much damage, beside that its fine. More concerns I have about Flare Gun, which is very cheap item and u can get it after first 2-3 creep waves. That additional spell damage at that stage of the game is taking huge part of HP away which allowes some heroes to one-shot enemies with their abilities. I strongly suggesting to increase price into sth around 1.8k minerals or remove energy scaling from that item

It is especially scaring on rancor, as I personally see my friend Doug rush flare gun almost every game with him, and then he will go gank somewhere with it and take out 1/2 to 3/4 of the enemy's hp with snipe+flare gun. He can get it by level 2 by csing and starting with flare gun parts.

[John]

Agree with spooky, flaregun seems more op than sunflare comparing the price.

[MOTHER]

I'm seeing waaaaay too many rushed flare guns these days, so there is definitely a problem.

[Muto]

It pains me to say this, since both flare-gun and sun-flare are among my favorite items, but it is OP. I would argue that Sun-flare is within the bounds of reason as it isn't that easy to rush early game and it's real potential is in the mid to late game. However, flare-gun definitely needs to be either increased in price or decreased in damage. With the wealth talent and a few neutral kills, I can get a flaregun and be back in the fight by the 2nd creep wave. It does way to much damage for this early in the game which is why many non-int heroes are starting to rush it as well.

[Hogwarts]

We mumblers have been saying this to the devs from day 1 pretty much of the new items. Even wrath a dev him self finds it way to strong. I have even taken Red into a test mode map to show him how strong it is and he has agreed its to strong. But we have yet to see a change.

 

I look forward to this item being nerfed. Its not game breaking by any means but its just to strong

[MOTHER]

Bumping this thread up because this item and flare gun really ought to be nerfed.

[Ironsights]

sunflare could use a damage cap, more accurately one that isn't as high as it is now (since its based on energy, theoretically you can only have so much energy, therefore it can only do so much damage, but...)

 

solar flare could use a price increase. Fun Gun is cheap (literally) and easy to get, allowing for some sick early farm in pubs. It's not "broken" but it could help the over all sunflare issue, since mass farming kills would be more expensive, thus slowing down the eventual purchase of sunflare.

[Etd]

I will agree that Flare gun is overpowered in terms of early game damage.. But sun flare? Really? It's fine... But the time someone purchases it (assuming they are rushing your tank should easily have spell buffer or korhal. If they don't and you havnt added hp and instead went 3 item glass cannon that's your fault.

[Moo]

I will agree that Flare gun is overpowered in terms of early game damage.. But sun flare? Really? It's fine... But the time someone purchases it (assuming they are rushing your tank should easily have spell buffer or korhal. If they don't and you havnt added hp and instead went 3 item glass cannon that's your fault.

Sunflare does like 1.5k damage late game, that is OP. It is OP because this also gives other decent stats and this amount of damage from an active is absurd. Every hero has a cyprus ulti without rocks if they get it. It's single target damage is just dumb, and it needs to have a flat cap, which is something others have agreed on also.

[Rim]

Sunflare does like 1.5k damage late game, that is OP.

 

SFG can certainly do 1.5k damage late game, but I fail to see how that is OP. Declaring something to be OP does not make it so. If you're talking about raw damage output, then nearly all AA heros are capable of dealing 2-3k damage in 2 seconds and some like Nova can deal over 5k in 2 seconds with just the use of Q. Int heros often have hard hitting skills but tend to have long CD's similar to that of SFG. If put into perspective SFG is hardly of concern unless you have no health/resist items.

 

Flare is only easy to get so early because people have half or more of the cost with starting funds. Flare Gun by itself is balanced just fine, but because so many people rush it (especially in a public game) and health tends to be a secondary purchase for most players it feels awfully unfair. Personally I think flare could get toned down with it's INT scaling or boost the damage to 200 and remove the scaling on flare. Makes it a good finisher type item but a player shouldn't expect to rush it just for the sake of doing a solo combo early in the game for first blood.