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I lub Dustin, but, have to admit...


barwick
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His R is just a bit on the "strong" side.

 

Now, listen, his Q and W are strong, but, they need to be, they're all he really has. And his Q is tough to hit once heroes start moving fast.

 

I saw the recent balance changes, but think you don't need to change his int scaling (nor do I think that would have that much impact on him, though it would hurt certainly).

 

What I DO think needs to be done, is change his R.

 

Right now it's reset all cooldowns:

L1: 30 Second cooldown, 2 sec cast time

L2: 20 Sec cooldown, 1 sec cast time

L3: 10 Sec cooldown, 0 sec cast time

 

What I think needs to happen is the following:

L1: 30 Sec cooldown, 2 sec cast time (but can cast while moving)

L2: 20 Sec cooldown, 2 sec cast time (but can cast while moving)

L3: 10 Sec cooldown, 2 sec cast time (but can cast while moving)

 

So, this way, I (er, I mean Dustin), can't just walk up to a patch of enemy heroes in a team fight, go E, Q, W, R, W, Q and insta-wipe 3/4 of their team's HP. There will at LEAST be a 2 second break in there for his R to go off. Then have that same thing happen again 20 seconds later after he R's, waits 10 secs, and then goes E Q W R W Q again.

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barwick I like your idea on his ultimate. but in reality look at this ulti energy cost, now look at laser and missile energy cost. your looking at about 700 energy to cast those abilities a second time. the cost is the means. to do the damage he has to burn energy. with talent for 5% spell, argus, and yamato active his missiles do 1k damage with 600 intel. meaning no defense items. wont count laser damage but its about 700 damage true. easy to avoid that. so missiles you can get about 2 missiles off before yamato buff is done. gravity edge. and all enemy have 50% spell resist. very easy to get. you are looking at 675 damage per missile. so vs 1 target casting ur ulti to do missiles again isn't worth it unless its can kill them. vs 2-3 its worth it. now take rancor nuke. I cant remember full scaling but something like 320+70% int. it does about 1k damage. and u can spam it 3 times. energy cost way less then dustin. and it can hit more then 4 targets. I believe the amount is called infinity as long as they fit in his circle which is a large area.

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Are

You

Serious

 

Toxi is a carry but also a tank but also his spell damage is insanely high but also slows but also reduces weapon speed and has 6 weapon range and high lvl 1 dmg to harass everything + his passive poison damage

 

Dustin is more item dependant and unless he is mid he is too easy to harass. Low str and low armor, untill lvl 11 his ult is almost useless. His early game damage is low, specially with the cheap hp items.

 

But meh a dustin stomps you guys a couple of times in ih and everyone is crying, but nobody is complaining about how powerful is toxi, just because is so ez to play that anyone plays it on ih with good results so better dont complain about him

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@Residente I highly agree with you on this. Most of the time, certain heroes get nerfed for no apparent reason. So if a hero has a high skill ceiling, and thats why they are good, they will be nerfed. So somebody plays Maar well, nerfed. Same goes with Gara, Dustin, and others. Im pretty sure that if you could stomp people with Jakk in ih, he would get nerfed. Its just kind of stupid the way things get nerfed.... But some people just ban the same people everytime, then cry about heroes being op just because somebody plays them extremely well. IMO, Dustin, Maar, didnt deserve nerfs, but Gara needs to be fixed...

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Yes, but you first has to survive 30 minutes to reach level 16, and farm like a mofo, to have a high amount of INT and Energy if you want to do a fair amount of damage

 

Like farming on him is actually that hard? His E acts similar to a destruction aurora from MAAR. He has decent weapon range and his drone allows him to see anyone coming that might be cloaked or lingering. If you waste all your energy focusing down a hero in your lane early game that's your own fault, wealth+ two start items for ihans.. plus energy+energy regen talents gives you more than enough energy sustain early game.

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@Residente I highly agree with you on this. Most of the time, certain heroes get nerfed for no apparent reason. So if a hero has a high skill ceiling, and thats why they are good, they will be nerfed. So somebody plays Maar well, nerfed. Same goes with Gara, Dustin, and others. Im pretty sure that if you could stomp people with Jakk in ih, he would get nerfed. Its just kind of stupid the way things get nerfed.... But some people just ban the same people everytime, then cry about heroes being op just because somebody plays them extremely well. IMO, Dustin, Maar, didnt deserve nerfs, but Gara needs to be fixed...

 

You obviously don't know what you're talking about. Maar isn't difficult to play once you grasp how to use his auroras properly. His INT scaling was WAY to high late game and would allow a team pretty far behind to catch up and turtle because of the range on his Fireballs+His Ult and extend games 30 mins longer at times... If you could stomp people with Jakk in IH? Really? Have you even seen a good Jakk? He does stomp people in IH... The fact you think Maar and Dustin are fine but that Gara needs fixing indicates you haven't played a competitive game in a while, so why try and talk about these points like you have?

 

Dustin can bring a whole team down at least 1/2 if not 3/4 of their HP, he's still strong in Beta.His problem is his ability to do TRUE damage with his laser.. if it was spell damage he would be fine.

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Like farming on him is actually that hard? His E acts similar to a destruction aurora from MAAR. He has decent weapon range and his drone allows him to see anyone coming that might be cloaked or lingering. If you waste all your energy focusing down a hero in your lane early game that's your own fault, wealth+ two start items for ihans.. plus energy+energy regen talents gives you more than enough energy sustain early game.

 

Yeah let's waste 2 talent points on energy and energy eregen when later you will not need them anymore. Ofc farming with Dustin is not that hard, but you can't compare it with how farm an agility hero. No one is retard enought to dont take E at level 1 and farm with it, and use all your mana only for that, that's what I personally do, its pointless to waste mana on laser and rockets because your enemy will just leech auto attacking or regen super fast if he is str. What is useless is to get mana and mana regen, I take 1-3-2 with the +15 weapon damage, its much easier to farm than getting mana and mana regen talents and use your drone, I get both speed, cdr, health and armor, and farm ihan in 12-15 minutes (more or less).

 

I'm not talking random crap like if I didn't know what I'm talking about (and I'm not accusing you to do it, don't missunderstand me with that last sentence)

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Yeah let's waste 2 talent points on energy and energy eregen when later you will not need them anymore. Ofc farming with Dustin is not that hard, but you can't compare it with how farm an agility hero. No one is retard enought to dont take E at level 1 and farm with it, and use all your mana only for that, that's what I personally do, its pointless to waste mana on laser and rockets because your enemy will just leech auto attacking or regen super fast if he is str. What is useless is to get mana and mana regen, I take 1-3-2 with the +15 weapon damage, its much easier to farm than getting mana and mana regen talents and use your drone, I get both speed, cdr, health and armor, and farm ihan in 12-15 minutes (more or less).

 

I'm not talking random crap like if I didn't know what I'm talking about (and I'm not accusing you to do it, don't missunderstand me with that last sentence)

Well you're comparing an INT hero to an agility hero, what would you want improved? Maybe if INT items were cheaper? But to what degree does that make the game balanced or unbalanced? Typically INT hero's are good for their burst damage or spells, they don't need a TON of farm to do CONSIDERABLE damage, I'm sure you're familiar to what happens to an AA carry that gets denied their farm.

 

You say it's pointless because it doesn't matter later on in the game- Does the +15 weapon damage matter later in the game? Does the +6 movement speed matter later in the game? All you're doing is poking with Dustin you don't need to be super speedy unless you're trying to be super greedy :) If the energy talents help you sustain early game mana problems, would they not be useful? You can buy Grav edge+ Lockbox and have plenty of movement speed for Dustin, no?

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Well you're comparing an INT hero to an agility hero, what would you want improved? Maybe if INT items were cheaper? But to what degree does that make the game balanced or unbalanced? Typically INT hero's are good for their burst damage or spells, they don't need a TON of farm to do CONSIDERABLE damage, I'm sure you're familiar to what happens to an AA carry that gets denied their farm.

 

You say it's pointless because it doesn't matter later on in the game- Does the +15 weapon damage matter later in the game? Does the +6 movement speed matter later in the game? All you're doing is poking with Dustin you don't need to be super speedy unless you're trying to be super greedy :) If the energy talents help you sustain early game mana problems, would they not be useful? You can buy Grav edge+ Lockbox and have plenty of movement speed for Dustin, no?

 

I do not want int items cheaper, I want HP to be more expensive, it's obviously retarded how easy you can get LR and Pulse Hammer, 2000 and 2300, they also give you good stats for your agi hero, but if you want that on a caster you need seed, ihan or nitrogen, and they are way more expensive. I've played enough IHs and ofc pub games to see that a caster ends almost on nothing when every agi hero on the enemy team gets that 2 items and every str hero just buy khoral, spell buffer, to make you even more useless. I'm sure Dustin can be good on ihs but he needs much more money to be useful, because his base damage + base int on his spells are tickles to Toxi with Rod+Hammer+1-2 machettes, 2500 health in the mid game...

 

+15 weapon damage is 1 talend, while the mana sustain requires 2, so it's worthy, you also have 6 weapon range as you said, so autoattacks are annoying for the enemy hero, much more than spamming shapty lvl1-2-3 rockets. The movementspeed matter, specially on late game, when your enemies maybe buy speed. Gravity is always on a Dustin build, just because of the stats and adding dmg to drone/rockets, so dustin will be even faster, he has 0 scape skills, so movement speed DOES matter, it also matter for chasing, and no, I can't buy lockboox on dustin because it doesnt synergize so I dont want to waste a slot for some poor stats

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I do not want int items cheaper, I want HP to be more expensive, it's obviously retarded how easy you can get LR and Pulse Hammer, 2000 and 2300, they also give you good stats for your agi hero, but if you want that on a caster you need seed, ihan or nitrogen, and they are way more expensive. I've played enough IHs and ofc pub games to see that a caster ends almost on nothing when every agi hero on the enemy team gets that 2 items and every str hero just buy khoral, spell buffer, to make you even more useless. I'm sure Dustin can be good on ihs but he needs much more money to be useful, because his base damage + base int on his spells are tickles to Toxi with Rod+Hammer+1-2 machettes, 2500 health in the mid game...

 

+15 weapon damage is 1 talend, while the mana sustain requires 2, so it's worthy, you also have 6 weapon range as you said, so autoattacks are annoying for the enemy hero, much more than spamming shapty lvl1-2-3 rockets. The movementspeed matter, specially on late game, when your enemies maybe buy speed. Gravity is always on a Dustin build, just because of the stats and adding dmg to drone/rockets, so dustin will be even faster, he has 0 scape skills, so movement speed DOES matter, it also matter for chasing, and no, I can't buy lockboox on dustin because it doesnt synergize so I dont want to waste a slot for some poor stats

See you're still thinking Dustin as a super greedy hero. The lockbox is perfect early-mid game because it gives him an escape. It gives intel+movement speed as well, so I don't see how it doesn't synergize with him? You could also always buy an impact dial, Dustin doesn't need to be a glass cannon always, just with the current meta that is how people use him because he can do so much damage. You shouldn't be spamming rockets early game, if you are using your E you can last him them anyway. If you're concerned about an early damage stat buy a spade to begin with after your pendant-- it builds into grav anyway.

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See you're still thinking Dustin as a super greedy hero. The lockbox is perfect early-mid game because it gives him an escape. It gives intel+movement speed as well, so I don't see how it doesn't synergize with him? You could also always buy an impact dial, Dustin doesn't need to be a glass cannon always, just with the current meta that is how people use him because he can do so much damage. You shouldn't be spamming rockets early game, if you are using your E you can last him them anyway. If you're concerned about an early damage stat buy a spade to begin with after your pendant-- it builds into grav anyway.

 

Well Dustin as a super greedy hero, it's not how the hero is but how you play it, I always play super-safe but I never care of my own Health when trying to help an allie. Ofc in a pub game I will not be risky with a retard, but I'll try to help everyone always I can, and my mates can confirm that... I play with a mixture of harassment and aggresiveness and I'm also careful, looking always on the minimap and on the fog of war to see with my drone possible ganks.

 

Oh man I'm #1 fan of Impact Dial, and I NEVER build glas cannon. But how Lockbox synergizes with him? I think you can trap people but Dial is useful in more ways, it's also amazing on allies. I only see Lockbox viable for Rory, Jakk, Null... Sure you can say Lockbox then you 100% laser accuracy, but you could do it with Maar red balls, Unix fungal, Micro toss, Lurker thorn strike... idk, I just think it's useless for him. But I indeed love Impact Dial, you can make your enemies lose their postion, save your allies, and do other stuff.

 

sorry for bad gramar

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Yes, but you first has to survive 30 minutes to reach level 16, and farm like a mofo, to have a high amount of INT and Energy if you want to do a fair amount of damage

 

Yup. Dustin is like Protoss. Late game he's absurd as crap. You have to crush him early through mid game and you have a chance late game. Early game he's impossible to kill because he's so dodgy and long range.

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The reason vespus doesn't get banned so easily is because there is one item that can counter most of his damage. parallax generator. where dustin you need 2 items to counter. you know no one likes building to counter another hero they just want to go glass cannon and be able to kill everything with out dying. simple build for almost any agility hero. lets them carry and stay alive. pyre, lightning rod, sliptide, force of entropy, darwinmight, galactic defender. but why go that build when you can just do, pyre, time spliter, masamune, khali blade, HOM, phantom menace. 350 dps or 600 dps. 3k hp and resist or 1.6k hp and no resist.

 

and dustin is not hard to kill early game, he is actually very easy. basic build he starts off with 3 armor and 650 hp. if he every gets away from the tower and you do a full engagement on him not neko out and run, you can kill him and stay alive. his cool downs early game are long. and don't do shap for damage.

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Honestly, just do as residente says because in nerfing his skills practically makes him a lot less of a viable hero to pick, as he already has 1 of the worst starting health and so why nerf the only thing that lets him deal damage. What makes him OP right now is his ulti letting him spam his skills.

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The reason vespus doesn't get banned so easily is because there is one item that can counter most of his damage. parallax generator. where dustin you need 2 items to counter. you know no one likes building to counter another hero they just want to go glass cannon and be able to kill everything with out dying. simple build for almost any agility hero. lets them carry and stay alive. pyre, lightning rod, sliptide, force of entropy, darwinmight, galactic defender. but why go that build when you can just do, pyre, time spliter, masamune, khali blade, HOM, phantom menace. 350 dps or 600 dps. 3k hp and resist or 1.6k hp and no resist.

 

and dustin is not hard to kill early game, he is actually very easy. basic build he starts off with 3 armor and 650 hp. if he every gets away from the tower and you do a full engagement on him not neko out and run, you can kill him and stay alive. his cool downs early game are long. and don't do shap for damage.

 

 

Hey bro do u kniw that even with parallax he is still a carry? You dont counter him at all with that item because he right clicks you and u are slowed to dead anyway

 

And i agree in the second point

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@Lucky So Maar/Dustin is like a carry because they have high scaling and can actually do jack in the late game. OH NO WE MUST NERF THEM! They are kind of like a carry in the fact that they can carry. So anybody that does damage late game is op? Hmm. Interesting. Why not we make everybody have heal beams? Dustin does true damage, that means it isnt benefited by Grav Edge, Yamato, or Argus. So it balances itself out fairly well. So Garamond is a problem eh? How many people can actually play a good gara? Tell me please.

We seem to nerf people because somebody out plays everybody else. But if another person say micro, does well with everybody, we just accept it.

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