Boros and Masamune

[Fenrir]

Riflobingdicilous... I almost don't want to say anything else.

 

With only Masamune he has only 8 seconds between spell storms and does 5k to the obelisk with just his ult...

 

Nor does it seem to make him any weaker I had sereval instances of Kerri (me) and a marine king with thor and full marines vs only boros we were destroyed everytime it was never close.

 

I've felt boros was op for a long time I can't think of any other hero who can get total spell immunity and gets massive lifesteal on thier untouchable ult. Why shouldn't toxi or vergil get this? (because it would obviously be op)

 

I really think the SS needs a nerf and his Ult range should be dropped a lot. It should be a meele range like nova's or erekul's not like ghost's lockdown.

 

Masamune definatly needs to be reworked it is a game ender with out much danger as I've heard it was supposed to be.

[WhaleTits]

you are cordially invited to play boros with/against us on mumble at any time within reasonable north american/eu hours, and then we shall have a balance debate over the issue after the game with devs/moderators and the inhouse community, if you still feel the necessity.

 

 

in the mean time, please enjoy this context

 

[Ironsights]

this is a masamune issue, not boros.

 

there was a time, not that long ago, when boros was scary as hell OP...now he's annoying with that bola (if hes good) and spell storm is still lolsy, but really he isn't any more deadly than the majority of the AA carries...ie hes in a pretty good spot.

 

Masamune on the other hand is riduculous...really really good item with nearly no draw back, especially with how easy it is to get armor these days.

 

I firmly believe it needs the 20% increased spell damage received added back on. Sure, 20% more physical damage taken is annoying, but with armor and leech it becomes irrelvant fast. The spell amp would make you have to be careful with when you get teh item and how you use it.

 

edit: whale's video is scary. I'm going to go have nightmares about robot kittens now.

[Banzaiguy]

you are cordially invited to play boros with/against us on mumble at any time within reasonable north american/eu hours, and then we shall have a balance debate over the issue after the game with devs/moderators and the inhouse community, if you still feel the necessity.

 

 

in the mean time, please enjoy this context

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=CRGlMYTx7yc

 

I still think calculating damage output by targets affected is rather flawed. I mean, you could just spawn 1000 obelisks and nuke them with Rancor and claim that he deals over 1 million damage in 3 seconds.

 

Not saying that Kitty doesn't have highest dps in the game though. He probably does because his ulti's high base damage is more than any other AA carry's damage steroids, even those that scale directly with weapon damage/dps.

 

P.S I thought Obelisks have no spell resist, so isn't grav edge unnecessary?

 

Edit: Does Explosive still proc on Lurker AA? Then he probably has the highest damage output if you count targets affected.

[WhaleTits]

I still think calculating damage output by targets affected is rather flawed. I mean, you could just spawn 1000 obelisks and nuke them with Rancor and claim that he deals over 1 million damage in 3 seconds.

 

Not saying that Kitty doesn't have highest dps in the game though. He probably does because his ulti's high base damage is more than any other AA carry's damage steroids, even those that scale directly with weapon damage/dps.

 

P.S I thought Obelisks have no spell resist, so isn't grav edge unnecessary?

 

Edit: Does Explosive still proc on Lurker AA? Then he probably has the highest damage output if you count targets affected.

 

grav edge isn't necessary if the goal were to kill 0 Spell resist obelisks, but what leo build isn't going to have a grav edge in an actual situation?

 

yes obviously aoe such as explosive or rancor's nukes scales indefinitely with number; leo's ult does not.

[xNOVAxPRIMEx]

Ya i almost always try to get masa with boros and Cerbro. ya his base damage with no items is close to 3k on obelisk i believe but thats against a unit with no resist along with not moving. Each attack is affected by resists so it does cut off alot of damage allthough it stil does sustainable damage. If im playing against a compitent team they know better to ward jungle area knowing they will die 1v1 if we meet otherwise in lanes there are always creeps near by to prevent full damage.

 

I dont know if he has too much range i mean the range should = the AoE of his jumps. if you make AoE smaller it might even be a buff because they have to get THAT much closer to creeps. If the Jump is 6 units you shuould be able to cast it form 6 units.

[Itsthatguy]

I don't really find this a problem...

 

Masamune reduces only physical resistance [Or amplifies, whichever you want to say].

 

Spell Storm = Spell Resist Immunity --- No effect of Physical Resistance. I would see that it would be less fair is Masamune reduced spell Resist. [since it worked on % the -20% ment nothing back then.]

 

???

 

Also 5000K Damage to Obelisk. yawn....

Insert an easy accessable 40 armor for your 70.5% Physical Resistance. Gasp! It deals a devestating 1475 Damage!

60 Armor ---> 84% Physical Resist.... 800 Damage... These numbers can be commonly seen for armor and still have fairly high health. I've LEECHED more Health off of one attack than what full boros final has done on a 60 armor enemy... [Note: I factored out Crit Damage, or course crit damage is rather limited as it is random. In addition if boros goes Crit Items, you can basicly always assume which items boros is going to go and just counter it].

 

P.S. Boros isn't invul during Ulti

1) Unix Sap can kill him during ulti

2) Leo Reflect

3) Barb armor [if boros had SS on CD that is]

4) Maar's Sap [Only targetable ability that literally works during Boro's Ulti].

 

Counters:

1) Mossberg Taser [silence him and he cant spell storm or ulti]

2) Lock Box

3) Phase Cloak [Early game counter, boros can't target cloaked units]

4) Bandit Artifice If you such a big threat that boros auto ultis you. Use Bandit Artifice as he will immediately use final to kill you as fast as possible only to kill a clone. If he doesn't ulti the clone, you clone still had soak up damage and deal damage to boros.

5) Shadow Vortex

6) Nearly all cloaking abilities early // mid game

 

 

Really, boros has just been getting nerf after nerf.

Sure he will be OP if you feed him, but since when isn't ANYONE OP when they are fed. The only fed hero i can see not being OP is Queen... And she'd still be hard as hell to deal with.

[Jaysi]

Suggestion for Masamune if you think that's the problem: Get rid of the Time, give it a bonus movement speed and allow it to increase AS cap, so it's essentially doing the same thing but without lowering debuffs and spell cooldowns?

 

Also Whale, were you maxed AS with Kitty(Guess if you Qed you could be)? Since you had no weapon speed/agility(Barely from Yamato) items?

 

And Boros is far from OP, haven't seen a Boros rape a pub in a long time(Last one had a Hive Symbiosis and that worked very well for him since it's hard to Axe Boros). He's melee and has no jump, so his escape is minimal he also has no base slows, stuns, or movement speeds. So he has to invest in items to do that and that sets him back. If you're dying to his Ult you've got to play smarter. Stick with creeps or allies, lockbox, jumping up ramps sometimes works, cloak, etc all help.

[VasyaKot]

Also 5000K Damage to Obelisk. yawn....

Insert an easy accessable 40 armor for your 70.5% Physical Resistance. Gasp! It deals a devestating 1475 Damage!

60 Armor ---> 84% Physical Resist.... 800 Damage... These numbers can be commonly seen for armor and still have fairly high health. I've LEECHED more Health off of one attack than what full boros final has done on a 60 armor enemy... [Note: I factored out Crit Damage, or course crit damage is rather limited as it is random. In addition if boros goes Crit Items, you can basicly always assume which items boros is going to go and just counter it].

crit damage is not so random on boros because a proper boros always has ~95% crit chance and 60% crit damage. In fact you crit for 300 TRUE damage every hit. With ulti it is 360 true damage... 360 * 8 = 2280 guaranteed damage, not mentioning the physical... Also you cant stack much armor on str heroes without significant reduction in hp, so something like 45 armor is maximum.

 

Btw super late game you cant kill anyone with your ulti, but you have maxed attack speed, and a fairly nice ~4 movement speed. If you managed to isolate a hero he is dead, even if he is some kind of 9000 hp drake, because the weapon speed, movement speed, 500 weapon damage, and 300 true damage are going to devastate even the toughest tanks.

[Crimson]

Mas is great sure but that damage you take is a pretty big draw back thats 20%- phy res now vs a bio he ults (55% now rite?) an a ray marks (30%) you then your hit by aa with conshards your mostly over kill by that point toss some stuners in there as well you helpless.

 

I dont think it needs to be change any way for the fact its not any more powerfull then a yamoto or argus its a late game item it should have a little kick to it or whats the point in having late game high end items? could always go back to having next to no items with no counter items such as moss an sp cloak.

[akanna]

You can't possibly be complaining about 8 second SS cd, he used to be able to perma spam it.....

 

Boros has been nerfed enough times that he really isnt that big a threat anymore unless you get caught out 1v1 with no creep backup

 

 

As for maurasume on agi heros that 20% bonus damage really only nets 5-10% more damage overall due to high armor based resistances, not nearly as big a drawback as ppl make it out to be. It should really increase spell damage :/

 

Now if you grab shard and say toss on a raynor or darpa bonus, it def adds up :)

[Divinesashi]

Are people still complaining about Boros? Lol

[pchacker]

Boros is very situational these days, you hardly see anyone in pubs play a successful boros now. When he was op you would see boros every game without fail, im lucky to see 1 in 10 games now.

[residente]

Boros is very situational these days, you hardly see anyone in pubs play a successful boros now. When he was op you would see boros every game without fail, im lucky to see 1 in 10 games now.

 

in my NA experiences, i've seen much more bola-boros than Q+R boros, and that's nice, because ppl dont like one shot ppl anymore (i guess lol), and its rly fun to play against a good bolaer

[Doom]

One of these days...... one of these days I'm going to find the courage to pick Boros in an Inhouse, and then I shall prove my case......

 

until then....

 

Boros' offensive capabilities are quite balanced, and the people that qq about them are incompetent. His defensive capabilities on the other hand are too much for my liking, but.that is not really relevant to the topic at hand. I do not know why you think massume is at all good on him. There are items that give similar weapon damage, without the drawbacks, and Massume only increases his one "weakness" to physical damage, if it can even be called that, due to his natural high armor. An AA Boros properly played is a kimikadze hitter, simmilar to Cyprus, except with better damage to multiple targets, more tanking potential, and less escape abilities.

 

Having played a few inhouses recently, I realized why the mighty Inhausers are so unafraid of AA heroes, or Cyprus, etc. All the heroes picked are super tanks. The only 2 int hero I saw picked, were Erekul and Rory. Other than Nova, Darpa, Toxi, Vergil, and Rancor, no agi were picked either. And let's face it, vergil, rancor, and toxi (the way he was played) are little better at aa than unix is. Everything is either tanky, or has mad escape abilities, but more commonly both. There is literally nothing to take a bite out of, if you are a melee AA. Nova and Darpa get ahead by arriving when everyone is at 20% hp, with everything on cooldown, then proceeding to clean up. It's not so much their aa, as their free get-out-of-jail cards of Jump and Vanish that are so prized, and let's face it, shadow, zera and boros are better at jumping in, than jumping out. The typical team fight lasts hours. Seriously, by the time the first tank dies, a team fight in a pub game (consisting of 3+ aa heroes) would have ended, the dead respawned, and a second team fight would have been played out. I strongly suspect that the reason for all of this is because no one wants to screw up badly, and suffer the consequences to their reputation. After all, it is much easier to screw up as a melee AA hero, trying to kill a team with Balrog, Vergil, Mandrake, Vorpal, and Nova than it is to screw up with a superbly tanky hero with plenty of escape abilities and extra hp enough to escape a 5v1 gank.