Parallax Fix

[BestZeratul]

This is a repost from an idea I had in residente's balance thread.

 

A lot of players are complaining that the item is too strong at the moment and that it is also unreliable because it just procs every 10 seconds. The suggested fix is to make it an active again. I am not sure about this fix because I assume what was intended when it was made passive was to create a way to remove silences (which is of course not possible when the item is active).

 

My suggestion is to make it an item that procs whenever a debuff is applied to the hero, with an internal cooldown (somewhere around 25 seconds would be fitting I guess). The idea comes from Linken Sphere from dota which does the same for single targeted spells.

 

I think this is superior to making it an active for 3 reasons :

1 - The element of randomness is removed, you know when it is on cooldown and when it isn't.

2 - It is counterable, by applying several debuffs in a short time (for example rory can taser before using molotov so he will be able to deal damage to heroes with parallax later in the game even if it harder than without it).

3 - The item would still provide a counter to silences.

 

Cons :

1 - It would nerf silencing spells and items pretty hard since the debuff would be cleared instantly, making this ability weaker than before.

2 - I am unsure about the interactions between neutrals and debuffs but that could be an issue as well.

[residente]

I like Linkens, and Parallax should be that way, you wanna counter molo? Ok, but the rest of the teamfight debuffs should work on you.

[xNOVAxPRIMEx]

I think thats viable and reasonable, kind of like elec mantle but applied on debuff then forced to CD.

[Jaysi]

Eh, I feel like nitrogen retrofit and FoE would be powerful... How would debuff auras work like Jacksons?

 

Would almost have to give like 2 to 5 seconds of debuff immunity on activation

[Adamantium]

Yeah, that depends on the internal cooldown.

[Psyght]

I don't like this idea, because when you say parallax has some randomness to it, when infact it has none.. its a debuff every X amount of seconds, if you have something you want to cast on someone with parallax, its easy, stand wait for it to proc, then as soon as its done, you have 8 guaranteed seconds where they dont have it. idk, with an active you could abuse it way more.

[NoWaterJustIce]

I do like this :) +1

[Doom]

If it counters just one debuff, this item will get steamrolled by most heroes. For example, Parallax is currently a really strong counter to Darpa, because it removes Vendetta stacks, Silence, and Spider. With this change, his first attack triggers the debuff removal, and so, your protection against all his skills is gone before he even uses one. Items that create a debuff are rather cheap, such as Pulse Hammer, Taser, Lockbox, Executioneer's Ax, and obviously the mother of all the cheap ones, Boundary Scanner.

[NoWaterJustIce]

If it counters just one debuff, this item will get steamrolled by most heroes. For example, Parallax is currently a really strong counter to Darpa, because it removes Vendetta stacks, Silence, and Spider. With this change, his first attack triggers the debuff removal, and so, your protection against all his skills is gone before he even uses one. Items that create a debuff are rather cheap, such as Pulse Hammer, Taser, Lockbox, Executioneer's Ax, and obviously the mother of all the cheap ones, Boundary Scanner.

 

What if instead of removing debuffs it gave debuff imunity for 1-2 seconds after being activated by a debuff so immediately following debuffs are removed as well?

[VasyaKot]

Yes make it active! +1

[BestZeratul]

I don't like this idea, because when you say parallax has some randomness to it, when infact it has none.. its a debuff every X amount of seconds, if you have something you want to cast on someone with parallax, its easy, stand wait for it to proc, then as soon as its done, you have 8 guaranteed seconds where they dont have it. idk, with an active you could abuse it way more.

 

The randomness goes both way, you can't realistically control when 5 on 5 engagements are going to start and synchronize it with parallax procs (and god forbid several heroes in the enemy team have non-synchronized parallaxes), which you can't rely on it when there is an engagement and you can't counter it properly cause you won't be engaging on the parallax hero all the time but on his team as well.

 

If it counters just one debuff, this item will get steamrolled by most heroes. For example, Parallax is currently a really strong counter to Darpa, because it removes Vendetta stacks, Silence, and Spider. With this change, his first attack triggers the debuff removal, and so, your protection against all his skills is gone before he even uses one. Items that create a debuff are rather cheap, such as Pulse Hammer, Taser, Lockbox, Executioneer's Ax, and obviously the mother of all the cheap ones, Boundary Scanner.

What if instead of removing debuffs it gave debuff imunity for 1-2 seconds after being activated by a debuff so immediately following debuffs are removed as well?

 

Good point and good fix, as for the Jackson (silence in general really) problem, you can also have a 1 sec (?) delay between the moment when the debuff is applied and when the debuff immunity kicks in.

 

Yes make it active! +1

 

No words, plz post less.

[Spooky]

There are to many debuffs or even aura debuffs in game to make Parallax viable item this way. It would usually kick in at bad moments even if effect is delayed by 1-2 seconds. U are a little bit to close to guy with Chilling Artifact - item effect almost wasted. And again there would be no skill with this item. I think making it active is much better option. And it still would be a counter to silence and stuns but only if u activate it first. I just don't see any reason why any hero should have opportunity to overcome silence or stuns by himself after they are applied. Thats the idea of disabling hero - so he can do nothing by himself. And this is how it suppose to be. Item would become sth situational. Great against Rory molo or for Drake/Jackson to initiate without any disturb. Or for any other heroes which power is in their channeling abilities. Just make it 30-60 seconds cooldown with 3-5 seconds duration. Moreover u may consider to allow use active on your allies as well. So it would become great support item too (especially against Tosh) and would provide even higher skill cap.

[BestZeratul]

Thats the idea of disabling hero - so he can do nothing by himself. And this is how it suppose to be.

 

Yeah because other mobas all function this way and aos is more balanced and more successful than them so let's ignore them.

 

...

 

Oh wait ! It's not the case at all.

 

In all other games silence only affects spells and not items which allows more diversity and various counters to silence, the only viable reasons to make parallax passive are to provide a counter to silence or dumb the game down.

[Spooky]

I have no idea how it looks like in other mobas. Only played few games of Dota 2. And I don't mind if silence would affect only hero abilities. But stun should disable hero in every aspect. So how looks stun mechanics in other mobas? Isn't it dumb that hero can overcome stun by himself because of passive item effect? Its nice idea to hero passive ability, but this kind of item is just too powerful...

[zeeeend]

2 - It is counterable, by applying several debuffs in a short time (for example rory can taser before using molotov so he will be able to deal damage to heroes with parallax later in the game even if it harder than without it).

 

Rory can get within 5 range have his heroic passive "Dutch Whisky" Debuff the enemy so parallax activates then use taser and molotov and gg.

This item would be insanely weaker then the current parallax, since it wont counter rory anymore the most common reason people get it.

 

And alot more random then the previous since 70% of the heroes can apply a debuff. There is no way of telling when your parallax will proc in a teamfight. The result of this will be the same parallax as we have today but just occuring every internal cooldown instead of the fixed 10 seconds.

edit* Think this is the point doom is making.

[Psyght]

I'm just saying, much of a nerf to parallax and your going to have some shapty ass games where nobody wants to roll tank because if theres too much cc and debuffs youll just get insta flobed in team fights.

[KDawgKilla]

i like the idea of activating on debuff, but i think that the duration of debuff removal should stay the same of 2 sec's although the cd could be increased to 15 or so

[BestZeratul]

Rory can get within 5 range have his heroic passive "Dutch Whisky" Debuff the enemy so parallax activates then use taser and molotov and gg.

This item would be insanely weaker then the current parallax, since it wont counter rory anymore the most common reason people get it.

 

And alot more random then the previous since 70% of the heroes can apply a debuff. There is no way of telling when your parallax will proc in a teamfight. The result of this will be the same parallax as we have today but just occuring every internal cooldown instead of the fixed 10 seconds.

edit* Think this is the point doom is making.

 

Make it so rory's passive and chilling artifact and all the useless shap doesn't trigger it then.

[Rem]

Active, wih an auto 1 second delayed silence removal with an internal cd of 30 seconds or so, Whats the problem?

[zeeeend]

Make it so rory's passive and chilling artifact and all the useless shap doesn't trigger it then.

Lol what is useless and what is not ? Here are all the debuffs, might have missed some but have fun nameing which ones are shap and which aren't ?

 

 

Micro slime ?

Drake molten armor ?

Drake ulti ?

kerrigan boomerang ?

Bio ulti ?

Bio civ passive ?

Balrog lunge ?

Vorpal Jav ?

Ss carpet bomb ?

Brine Acid strike ?

Brine impale ?

Marine Supressive fire ?

Marine Grenede ?

Justicar strike(q, second one is a debuff)

Boros bola ? (yes its a debuff)

Zera void ?

Zera ulti ?

Darpa Vendetta ?

Darpa Tracking ?

Darpa Cyanide ?

Darpa grenade ?

shadow vortex ?

Shadow ulti ?

rancor snipe ?

rancor satellite ?

tosh Concussive ?

tosh spectre stun ?

vespus reflux ?

vespus fumes ?

vespus toxic tornado ?

tassa drain ?

grunty rocket ?

grunty trap ?

nova scoped ?

nova web ?

vergil disarming strike ?

crackling acid volley ?

terminus thorn strike ?

rory dutch whiskey ?

rory molotv ?

raynor mark ?

raynor raiders ?

raynor silencing shot

unix sticky trail ?

unix fungal ?

erekuls parasitic infusion ?

erekuls vengeance ?

egon caustic salve

egon proton pack?

gara oil ?

gara seeker swarm ?

gara mk38 laser turret ?

dustin active denial system ?

jackson magnetic presence ?

jackson link ?

jackson mass effect ?

maar despair ?

maar destroyer aura ?

maar frost wave ?

maar savior aura ?

queen ultralisk ?

jakk mine field ?

jakk force beam stun ?

null chrono distortion ?

null magic missle ?

geneva optic flare ?

 

 

also items

 

 

Executioners axe ?

time splitter ?

force of entropy ?

pulse hammer ?

shrinkray ?

stun baton ?

electric mantle ?

small hydron colider ?

chilling artifact ?

darksteel titan ?

shrapnel cloack ?

taser ?

nitrofit ?

lockbox ?

boundary scanner ?

 

 

All the bebuffs 81 would have to be manually excluded or included and some have 4 versions so that would be oh lets say 200 buffs to program in. Take it easy on the devs !

[pchacker]

Making it so that any debuff triggers the passive parallax is too much of a nerf imo. Since there are too many debuffs that can be used.

 

I actually think it would be better to make a silence not affect your ability to activate item actives. So then someone with parallax gets silenced then uses the parallax active and gets debuff immunity for 3 seconds with a cooldown of 25-30 seconds or something.

[Aellectris]

Actually, I think that Parallax might be fine if it didn't cloak people but rather made them shiny to indicate debuff immunity like LZ. One of the main issues I have is that cloaking has the same effect as the old stop glitch meaning that there IS actually an element of randomness because of projectiles somewhat randomly will not hit.

[Crimson]

There are to many debuffs or even aura debuffs in game to make Parallax viable item this way. It would usually kick in at bad moments even if effect is delayed by 1-2 seconds. U are a little bit to close to guy with Chilling Artifact - item effect almost wasted. And again there would be no skill with this item. I think making it active is much better option. And it still would be a counter to silence and stuns but only if u activate it first. I just don't see any reason why any hero should have opportunity to overcome silence or stuns by himself after they are applied. Thats the idea of disabling hero - so he can do nothing by himself. And this is how it suppose to be. Item would become sth situational. Great against Rory molo or for Drake/Jackson to initiate without any disturb. Or for any other heroes which power is in their channeling abilities. Just make it 30-60 seconds cooldown with 3-5 seconds duration. Moreover u may consider to allow use active on your allies as well. So it would become great support item too (especially against Tosh) and would provide even higher skill cap.

 

This is what I would do cause of all the many different debuffs.

 

As for Chilling artifact an other aoe debuffs why not make it so paralax res its effects abit some thing like 15 to 40% or make it caps your speed stats dont drop below this % some thing like 10 - 20% of ur speed when paralax is on that hero.

 

Then proc only to a stun or slient an gives debuff immunity for 3 secs an have a cd of 15secs to 20secs just for the fact if you cant kills some one in 8 to 12secs of stun locking then dam take a look at what there using an what your build is an fix it.

 

As for the cloak maybe make it proc every 4th to 5th hit u take or keep it on a timer still the time it lasts can be the same.

[Jaysi]

Making it so that any debuff triggers the passive parallax is too much of a nerf imo. Since there are too many debuffs that can be used.

 

I actually think it would be better to make a silence not affect your ability to activate item actives. So then someone with parallax gets silenced then uses the parallax active and gets debuff immunity for 3 seconds with a cooldown of 25-30 seconds or something.

 

I agree, but the silence

[Jaysi]

Making it so that any debuff triggers the passive parallax is too much of a nerf imo. Since there are too many debuffs that can be used.

 

I actually think it would be better to make a silence not affect your ability to activate item actives. So then someone with parallax gets silenced then uses the parallax active and gets debuff immunity for 3 seconds with a cooldown of 25-30 seconds or something.

 

I agree, but the silence of items might be a game engine limitation.