I'm surprised I haven't seen Jackson on a thread yet. I find him unbelievably UnderPowered.

[Ubida]

New here, but long time Aeon player.

 

I've recently been using Jackson - I love his strategy. But I find it hard to kill pretty much anything without any handicaps. He's a very useful player when used correctly. Effective against Unix and other INT or AGL players. But it doesn't quite cut it. His abilities are just too weak. And his weapon damage output is pretty much non-existant.

 

Early game, he's perfectly balanced. (Or is he?). But if you don't do well, and fall behind from not killing enough creeps, you'll pretty much get killed instantly. Especially by STR players. (I.e, Marauder's Ulti).

 

His spell types and strategy should be unchanged, but perhaps here's a few things to consider:

 

- His Q move should explode whenever the target steps out of his range. However perhaps nerf the explosion damage. (I mean, when does his Q spell ever have the opportunity to explode late game? Jackson either gets killed first or the enemy have ran away).

 

- His Q move should stack (faster, too). And last longer, (corresponding to the first point). Start off with small damage, then stack up to 100dps. (Don't forget, Unix does way more damage than this).

 

- The enemy should be permanently silenced until they have stepped out of his current "W" range. (3.5/4?) (The silence is clearly not long enough for Jackson to do any close-up damage, by the time the silence ends, jackson is dead).

 

- His Ultimate move is vastly unbalanced. His cooldown is far too long for the amount of damage it does. (Perhaps reduce the cooldown by 30 seconds).

 

- The pull on his Ulti is not strong enough to be useful. All I suggest is increasing the 'pull' range. Perhaps a 7 unit radius. It will be useful to regroup with your team, and pulling your escaping enemies towards you. It will also give you a slight upper hand against ranged players.

 

Obviously considering all these suggestions all at once could perhaps balance Jackson a little too much. But at least consider a few points, especially his ULTI.

But just think; when facing someone like Nova 1v1, Jackson stands no chance whatsoever. He won't be able to get close enough before he does any damage at all. (Hence, why I suggest increasing pull range). Jackson has too many weak points, hence why no one uses him anymore.

 

So this is my first post. I hope everyone takes the time to read, and to balance Jackson.

[Ironsights]

Jackson may or may not need some love...I have seen good jacksons and a lot of bad ones, so he may well need some tweaking...Not sure what or how much, but yeah.

 

However, the below quote is a TERRIBLE arguement and I suggest you revise it:

 

"But just think; when facing someone like Nova 1v1, Jackson stands no chance whatsoever. He won't be able to get close enough before he does any damage at all."

 

Jackson is a -support- caster, designed to be part of a team, not a solo slayer. Nova is an assassin, literally designed to win 1v1 battles against nearly anything.

 

Under no circumstances should an equally leveled/geared jackson EVER beat a nova mono e mono...nor should jackson be able to readily dispatch much of anyone singlehandedly...maybe close battles but certainly not sure fire kills. Again, he is a support caster, designed to weaken and contain, allowing your team to get teh kills.

 

Its a lot like playing Drake, who is a support tank...he really doesn't have a hell of a lot to get kills with BUT he is GREAT at innitiating, pulling enemies into the fight, weakening everything around him and the whole boom thing...ya...

 

Point is, both are -support- styled heroes, meaning that both should have far more assists than kills.

 

Granted, Drake seems superior in nearly every circumstance, meaning Jackson may need som love, but neither of them should be able to straight one v one nova given equal gear/levels.

 

anyway. I'll stop ranting now.

[Ubida]

Jackson may or may not need some love...I have seen good jacksons and a lot of bad ones, so he may well need some tweaking...Not sure what or how much, but yeah.

 

However, the below quote is a TERRIBLE arguement and I suggest you revise it:

 

"But just think; when facing someone like Nova 1v1, Jackson stands no chance whatsoever. He won't be able to get close enough before he does any damage at all."

 

Jackson is a -support- caster, designed to be part of a team, not a solo slayer. Nova is an assassin, literally designed to win 1v1 battles against nearly anything.

 

Under no circumstances should an equally leveled/geared jackson EVER beat a nova mono e mono...nor should jackson be able to readily dispatch much of anyone singlehandedly...maybe close battles but certainly not sure fire kills. Again, he is a support caster, designed to weaken and contain, allowing your team to get teh kills.

 

Its a lot like playing Drake, who is a support tank...he really doesn't have a hell of a lot to get kills with BUT he is GREAT at innitiating, pulling enemies into the fight, weakening everything around him and the whole boom thing...ya...

 

Point is, both are -support- styled heroes, meaning that both should have far more assists than kills.

 

Granted, Drake seems superior in nearly every circumstance, meaning Jackson may need som love, but neither of them should be able to straight one v one nova given equal gear/levels.

 

anyway. I'll stop ranting now.

 

No I completely agree. But Jackson doesn't feel like a support. He just feels like a caster like Unix. A 1v1er. I suppose using Nova was a bad example. But I can't think of any hero's that he could single handily kill. (Perhaps Garamond, or the Goliath).

 

But having said that he's a support, his skills are not efficient enough. He needs to bring his enemies close to him to be effective. Since his damage resistance/health is rubbish, he's also usually the one a gank will target first. He'll die in a few hits unless he goes for a STR build. His abilities need more of a magnetic effect. Or to be more effective at long range.

[ProfessorInfestor]

Jackson is a high disruptive support, if used correctly, such as in IH, ganks with Jackson are really effective. Team fights can turn entirely one sided if he is fortunate. The game masters wisely understand this.

 

He brings a lot of deadly cc with him, but only if he gets close enough. That said, he is so tragically dependent on mobility, but his base speed is average (which means bad), which is a terrible unfun combination.

 

He needs to be tanky, but part of his tankiness derives from the damage he deals. So he's in a strange spot because he desperately needs to rush Warp shard soon (assuming his opponents are smart enough to stay away from him and that Jackson's role is initiating).

 

So spreading himself over Tankiness, damage, and mobility. Luckily damage and tankiness for Jackson go a bit hand in hand, especially with items such as Nitrogen retrofit (and that's just about it because unless his ganks are effective, he cannot afford much beyond that; his farming skills are poor until late game)

 

On paper Jackson is just strong and in practice he has been very strong. Nevertheless he could use some help, the items he demands are just too expensive for him.

 

If I had to change Jackson I would: Choose 2.

1. increase his STR scaling

2. Increase base movement speed

3. Make it so his ultimate channels and then teleports to target location AND THEN sucks in everyone. Like a cc Fiddlesticks ultimate. Nerf its damage if needed.

[Ubida]

Jackson is a high disruptive support, if used correctly, such as in IH, ganks with Jackson are really effective. Team fights can turn entirely one sided if he is fortunate. The game masters wisely understand this.

 

He brings a lot of deadly cc with him, but only if he gets close enough. That said, he is so tragically dependent on mobility, but his base speed is average (which means bad), which is a terrible unfun combination.

 

He needs to be tanky, but part of his tankiness derives from the damage he deals. So he's in a strange spot because he desperately needs to rush Warp shard soon (assuming his opponents are smart enough to stay away from him and that Jackson's role is initiating).

 

So spreading himself over Tankiness, damage, and mobility. Luckily damage and tankiness for Jackson go a bit hand in hand, especially with items such as Nitrogen retrofit (and that's just about it because unless his ganks are effective, he cannot afford much beyond that; his farming skills are poor until late game)

 

On paper Jackson is just strong and in practice he has been very strong. Nevertheless he could use some help, the items he demands are just too expensive for him.

 

If I had to change Jackson I would: Choose 2.

1. increase his STR scaling

2. Increase base movement speed

3. Make it so his ultimate channels and then teleports to target location AND THEN sucks in everyone. Like a cc Fiddlesticks ultimate. Nerf its damage if needed.

 

Very much agreed.

 

When I play Jackson, I play from a STR point of view. Similar tactic to Erekul. (And that's how I think Jackson should be played). But if you play from an INT point of view, his 'Unique' Shield ability is pretty much useless, or seems so anyway. His INT output isn't quite strong enough to keep his shields sponging damage. As I see that Jackson should be a "Check" type of character. His gameplay should force other players to move away, or gank Jackson. (Similar to checking a king in Chess. Either they have to move the king, or move another pawn in the way).

 

As for your suggest about teleporting with his Ultimate move, I couldn't agree more. I don't have easy access to Active items, since I don't have "F1"(etc) keys. I'm on a mac so the F's are routed to do different things. So I have to manually click on items. It would be much more convenient to teleport using the ulti. Also, it will give Jackson an AGL type feel, which is what he needs if he can't tank.

[Takeray]

Jackson is ok.

 

He has opportunities. but even if he can't, it doesn't care. Balance never should be done about possiblities in a concrete scenario.

[WhaleTits]

he sets up aoe absurdly well. obviously hes not going to be getting kills, thats not really his job.

 

hes going to be underpowered in pubs where theres less teamwork/teamfights. hes a bit weak in inhouse as well due to the massive nerf on his ult, cause he was op before. still, he does pretty well

[Ubida]

Jackson is ok.

 

He has opportunities. but even if he can't, it doesn't care. Balance never should be done about possiblities in a concrete scenario.

 

What do you mean? So you're saying he doesn't need to be balanced?

 

Personally, I insist that there needs to be something done about him. I've been playing as him the past few games, and it just frustrates me to no end when I can't kill a damn thing. I end up negative K-D most of the time. I rarely see anyone play as him either. I can definitely see why.

 

My last game aggravated me. I'm sitting there farming creep, then a gank of 2 (Ghost and Summers) gets me mid. I'm already on 3/4 of health left, Summers stuns me, then Ghost stuns me also, one hit later I'm dead, without being able to move. Didn't even see the Ghost coming since he's near invisible in the river.

 

So I'm off to a bad start already, I try and sit back behind the tower to farm but ganks just kept getting me, killing me almost instantly. My abilities do absolutely nothing to deter them from retreating. (And I had a bad team who didn't help me out either).

 

So now I had no cash and I'm on 0-3. From here on out, I can't kill ANYTHING unless I'm part of a gank (which never happened). My abilities do little damage, and by the time I get them with my silence move, they've killed me with their weapon damage.

 

I am not ever using Jackson again until he is balanced. /rage

[Psyght]

he sets up aoe absurdly well. obviously hes not going to be getting kills, thats not really his job.

 

hes going to be underpowered in pubs where theres less teamwork/teamfights. hes a bit weak in inhouse as well due to the massive nerf on his ult, cause he was op before. still, he does pretty well

ya i gotta agree with whale here, he can be insanely strong in team fights, i mean imagine if he lands his dream combo, right when someone like Null also lands his ult dream combo, i mean boom just like that you can team whipe. or if vergil lands his ult right after.. i mean jackson has one of the most usefull combos in the game. I think the channeling of his ult needs to be slightly shorter.

[Ubida]

ya i gotta agree with whale here, he can be insanely strong in team fights, i mean imagine if he lands his dream combo, right when someone like Null also lands his ult dream combo, i mean boom just like that you can team whipe. or if vergil lands his ult right after.. i mean jackson has one of the most usefull combos in the game. I think the channeling of his ult needs to be slightly shorter.

 

Oh I completely agree, I don't think getting the kills shouldn't be his main job. His spell combo is slick, probably the best combo-use out of all the characters. But we're looking at Jacksons strong points, and not his weaknesses. I feel that he is more of a burden to play as rather than a strong player to have.

 

You have to compare them to other characters. Take Maar for example. He's a support INT character. Extremely weak at close range, but deadly at long. Jackson is as physically weak as Maar, but has nothing to compensate his weakness. Maar can withstand some close combat, and heal himself in the process. Jackson has to get himself out of combat, regardless of his close combat abilities. His unique shield ability can perhaps save him on the odd occasion.

[Revolution]

Unix's R does more damage than Jackson's Q because its Unix's ult lol.. Jackson is not meant for killing. He is not a 1v1 hero. He jumps in uses his combo and lets his team cleanup. Also just because his ult doesn't do a lot of damage does not make it unbalanced. It is for utility not damage and by making it a range of 7 would be ridiculously op.

 

I do however think his Q should be changed because as you said you rarely ever see it explode.

 

A good jackson on your team is nowhere near a burden to play or have on your team. If played properly he is probably the strongest initiator in the game, which is his role.

 

Maar isn't really a support hero anymore. With the damage buffs he recieved (I still disagree with them) when ppl were saying he was UP he is more an INT Carry. And one of his strongest skills (Sap) is close ranged so hes deadly everywhere. You are comparing an INT Caster/Carry to an Initiator. The 2 have completely different roles and can't really be compared.

 

Also jackson has a 25% movement and attack speed slow, 2 stuns, a silence and a warpshard. Saying he has nothing to compensate for his none existent weakness is false.

 

I would say he's probably the hardest hero to play correctly in his state. Right along side tassadar and maybe Zeratul.

[Doom]

He's perfectly fine, if you ask me. The only time I had serious problems using him in an inhouse was against a team with a good Tosh. He'd just stay back, and prevent me from ever ulting, after which I was focused down. Impact Dial and SHC both work great with him, and he doesn't really need anything else to do well, maybe tank items/ aura slow build.

[Takeray]

What do you mean? So you're saying he doesn't need to be balanced?

 

 

 

No I was just speaking about a vs Nova or anything scenario.

 

sry if I was not clear.

[residente]

Meh, Jackson can be the difference between a win and a loss, he is if not the best, one of the best teamfight heros. If you want to get kills, pick an agi carry or a huge int nuker

[Ubida]

Meh, Jackson can be the difference between a win and a loss, he is if not the best, one of the best teamfight heros. If you want to get kills, pick an agi carry or a huge int nuker

 

I suppose at the end of the day, I haven't found a good team so I can effectively use Jackson. And it appears the community is happy with keeping him the same. I still insist on a change though.

 

/thread I guess.

[residente]

I suppose at the end of the day, I haven't found a good team so I can effectively use Jackson. And it appears the community is happy with keeping him the same. I still insist on a change though.

 

/thread I guess.

 

I commend you to search a team, premades are bm for some ppl but who cares, you should play Jackson then, in pubs, with a proper team, you will see what that guy can do, seriously!

[Ubida]

I commend you to search a team, premades are bm for some ppl but who cares, you should play Jackson then, in pubs, with a proper team, you will see what that guy can do, seriously!

 

I read that in Doc Stetmann's voice. Cheers

[EasyD]

If you communicate well with your team by typing and pinging you will do very well wth Jackson in pubs, even scoring kills. The new haste ability , along with his beam, can easy kill a squisher hero early game. You'll basically just follow around your team grabbing assists mostly. The silence he has is strong and once you farm enough for a warp shard there is no reason to lose team fights for a while. Jackson himself relies on his team, while the team relies on him to make killing a whole lot easier.

 

Farm assists with Jackson, not early game creeps.

[Eliwan]

Jackson WRECKS teamfights and sorta flops around otherwise.

 

I do support some Jackson changes: (and of these I only think that the first one is really important)

 

1) his Q explodes whenever the channel ends (Allowing him to not get roflstomped early game as hard and not shut down ENTIRELY by any CC)

2) his Heroic Passive (Reactive Armor; 12% of Spell Damage becomes shields) applies on all Spell Damage he deals, not just from abilities-- would make Shrapnel Cloak and SHM MUCH stronger on him; and would allow for some cheesy AA-Jackson builds

3) his Ultimate (Mass Effect, channel + draw everybody in) grants a base amount of shields (e.g. equal to the base damage); but does not grant shields from the Passive (12 * 5 = 60% so this is a buff in every way)

4) his E can be pressed again to automatically break the links, but only within a short time (e.g. 2 seconds from cast start; the duration's like 3.5 seconds right?)

[Misantrophy]

Although a lot of people say he is a support hero who works perfectly with a team (which I agree), I have to say that he is not a support hero as he cant do much without items like SHC or any tanky item, making him very farm dependant and a very hard hero to play because he is not very good at that. So, as someone stated before, it would be a good idea to make him a real support hero by increasing his str scaling and make his ulti teleport him :P

[Revolution]

Thats just it... he's not a support hero, he's an initiator.

[Ironsights]

I play on NA, Ironsights 505

 

If you are there, add me and I'll roll unix next to your jackson. Unix/Jackson is an amusing (pub at least) lane pair, well able to destroy anything flung at them throughout the early and mid game.

 

You Link up, I fungal to keep them there, they die. Later, add Unix Stick to the mix for maximum lols.

 

Fun times.

[Rem]

evil comboing unix with jack too....fungal, minefield, unix ulti u run your flobed you stay your flobed or unix with lz, or unix with well just about anyone....

[Qlx]

Jacksons purpose is AoE silence and Massive Focusation, which then works well with e.g. Drake or Vergil

[Banzaiguy]

Jacksons purpose is AoE silence and Massive Focusation, which then works well with e.g. Drake or Vergil

Q kinda breaks that teamfight style though. I'd rather it get reverted to lower damage output but aoe damage per tick like it used to be. Nobody really gets hit by the explosion at the end unless you've done haste+Yamato or they've been chain CCed. But still, I think it'd fit his role more to do lesser damage to more targets rather than high damage to a single target with some aoe at the end.