shogigut Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 I am wondering the worth of Lethal Barb on AGI carry. As an AGI carry I assume you have at least 150 agi towards late game, together with the 15% atk spd talent, the Bard itself brings you to 100.3%^205*115% = 213% atk spd. A crit proc will bring you to 213%*200% = 426%, very near to the atk spd cap. Does that mean if I'm to build Lethal Bard for a crit AGI carry build, I should not get any other AGI/atk spd items? If I still lumps up the AGI/atk spd, the unique on Lethal Bard is wasted. On the other hand, I need other crit item if I'm building crit, other than Khali Blade, an obvious choice will be Arcbound Ravager, which has an +40% atk spd bonus and does not work well with the Barb. In short, to make Barb works the best, you need crit items without AGi/atk spd, the only candidate is Cerebro. So is Lethal Barb a Boros-only item? Correct me if my math is wrong, I'm pretty new to the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rem Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 As i recall, a crit with barb brings you to attack speed cap period not pluss a specific percentage. So if your using a build with it, your going to skip other attack speed boosting items. Not saying you wont want them for other reasons IE stun baton, but your not getting anything to try and raise your attack speed. Secondly, khali and lethal combined offer you like a 50% crit chance, so on average you'll crit every other hit, On a crit you'll be at the attack speed cap for 2 seconds youll hit 4+ times in those 2 seconds so its an unbroken chain proccing lethal barb IE no need for further crit items. Or if for example your plkaying nova a hero who has a guaranteed first hit crit which will auto proc lethal barb ^_^ You can of course get unlucky with this combo, and manage not to crit for 3-4 hits in a row, but this can happen with any build unless you've got 100% crit. Eliwan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimera Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 I'd say it's good as an early item on a Nova and Kerrigan or as a late game item on a Boros but I wouldn't put it into my crit builds cause a better option would be to get two Arcbounds and a Khali. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhaleTits Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 op is correct. lethal is bought on kerrigan, boros, and nova. heroes with natural synergy for crit. I would include lurker but he isn't generally built AA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithdehun Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 I'd say it's good as an early item on a Nova and Kerrigan or as a late game item on a Boros but I wouldn't put it into my crit builds cause a better option would be to get two Arcbounds and a Khali. crit boros is so mainstream :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysi Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 This is the reason I'd like more critical items, because as OP pointed out, none of the other crit items synergizes well with Lethal other than Khali... Sometimes stacking Khalis might work(unlikely) because it gives huge weapon damage and crit chance. I feel like now is the perfect time for more crit items with the nerfing of pyre, crit has become the best way to deal with tanks now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aellectris Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 Having a crit build like that does give you a cool advantage in that it means you can basically max your crit/as (attack speed) with 3 items or so (Lethal, Khali, Masamune), and use the rest for survivability. You can build an Electric Mantle, Force of Entropy, and Parallax in order to make sure that you don't just melt to the other team, while still dealing tons of damage. akanna 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 I am wondering the worth of Lethal Barb on AGI carry. As an AGI carry I assume you have at least 150 agi towards late game, together with the 15% atk spd talent, the Bard itself brings you to 100.3%^205*115% = 213% atk spd. A crit proc will bring you to 213%*200% = 426%, very near to the atk spd cap. Does that mean if I'm to build Lethal Bard for a crit AGI carry build, I should not get any other AGI/atk spd items? If I still lumps up the AGI/atk spd, the unique on Lethal Bard is wasted. On the other hand, I need other crit item if I'm building crit, other than Khali Blade, an obvious choice will be Arcbound Ravager, which has an +40% atk spd bonus and does not work well with the Barb. In short, to make Barb works the best, you need crit items without AGi/atk spd, the only candidate is Cerebro. So is Lethal Barb a Boros-only item? Correct me if my math is wrong, I'm pretty new to the game. Personaly the way I use Lethal depends on the team your facing an hero your using as well. Theres many ways you can use Lethal 1 way is to help hit that attack speed cap cause your Agi hero needed to go abit more tanky which helps alot if they are a high burst team with crowd controller skills. As for the Arcbound Ravager on agi is so so i fine theres so much better items to get then that for a agi hero such as phantom mence since it gives that nice 50 agi as well better moving speed were u get no main stats for the Arcbound Ravager an crit alone on it isn't really worth it, it does help abit early on but late game not so much just for the fact most of its effects should be mostly useless at that point such as attack speed on it, an should be traded in for better items. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
residente Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 An obvious choice arcbound? Why you want that useless item when you have Shadowmourne on the pool? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akanna Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 lethal + Khali is always a good combo, then you focus on more dps like shard, marasume, shadowmourne, etc instead of other attack speed items, or get utility items like shrapnel etc. It usually takes 2-3 items to reach the cap even on an agi hero, lethal lets you do it in 1 even early on which frees up slots, and you can buy the +15% crit chance item thats a component of khali right after. Lethal is arguably better on heros like boros or nova that have a natural crit chance, but can be good on any hero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pchacker Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 As i recall, a crit with barb brings you to attack speed cap period not pluss a specific percentage. So if your using a build with it, your going to skip other attack speed boosting items. Not saying you wont want them for other reasons IE stun baton, but your not getting anything to try and raise your attack speed. Secondly, khali and lethal combined offer you like a 50% crit chance, so on average you'll crit every other hit, On a crit you'll be at the attack speed cap for 2 seconds youll hit 4+ times in those 2 seconds so its an unbroken chain proccing lethal barb IE no need for further crit items. Or if for example your plkaying nova a hero who has a guaranteed first hit crit which will auto proc lethal barb ^_^ You can of course get unlucky with this combo, and manage not to crit for 3-4 hits in a row, but this can happen with any build unless you've got 100% crit. Lethal on some agi heroes will not get you to the attack speed cap unless you also have the 15% weapon speed talent. I tried it with toxi and i was just below the cap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pchacker Posted January 22, 2013 Report Share Posted January 22, 2013 I am wondering the worth of Lethal Barb on AGI carry. As an AGI carry I assume you have at least 150 agi towards late game, together with the 15% atk spd talent, the Bard itself brings you to 100.3%^205*115% = 213% atk spd. A crit proc will bring you to 213%*200% = 426%, very near to the atk spd cap. Does that mean if I'm to build Lethal Bard for a crit AGI carry build, I should not get any other AGI/atk spd items? If I still lumps up the AGI/atk spd, the unique on Lethal Bard is wasted. On the other hand, I need other crit item if I'm building crit, other than Khali Blade, an obvious choice will be Arcbound Ravager, which has an +40% atk spd bonus and does not work well with the Barb. In short, to make Barb works the best, you need crit items without AGi/atk spd, the only candidate is Cerebro. So is Lethal Barb a Boros-only item? Correct me if my math is wrong, I'm pretty new to the game. I do crit builds these days on most of my aa carrys, I actually forgo pyre lategame and replace it with an extra khaliblade. foe darwins lethal barbed 3x khali blade *or replace 1 of the khali blades with a masamune if you are boros/nova/kerri This build takes a long time to get up and running but the damage you do lategame is worth it i feel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God Posted January 23, 2013 Report Share Posted January 23, 2013 I do crit builds these days on most of my aa carrys, I actually forgo pyre lategame and replace it with an extra khaliblade. foe darwins lethal barbed 3x khali blade *or replace 1 of the khali blades with a masamune if you are boros/nova/kerri This build takes a long time to get up and running but the damage you do lategame is worth it i feel youzzzzz trolllin I hope? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shogigut Posted January 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2013 An obvious choice arcbound? Why you want that useless item when you have Shadowmourne on the pool? Because I'm playing zera... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
residente Posted January 23, 2013 Report Share Posted January 23, 2013 Because I'm playing zera... so? zera is not just bubble, when it ends if anyone is alive the shadowmourne is amazing, specially against those who have something like FoE or Pyre shadowmourne is more expensive, but give you the same stats, in a minor amount, it also gives you 400 mana, something useful for zera, becuase he will have over 700 mana late game and 350 will be off because of ult, so another 400 is just give you more than 50% extra mana pool, and ofc, his unique... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhaleTits Posted January 23, 2013 Report Share Posted January 23, 2013 ur shadow as zera, is not affected by the bubble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shogigut Posted January 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2013 so? zera is not just bubble, when it ends if anyone is alive the shadowmourne is amazing, specially against those who have something like FoE or Pyre shadowmourne is more expensive, but give you the same stats, in a minor amount, it also gives you 400 mana, something useful for zera, becuase he will have over 700 mana late game and 350 will be off because of ult, so another 400 is just give you more than 50% extra mana pool, and ofc, his unique... umm...will try your suggestion, just afraid I will not have enough dmg output when building this, and it's really expensive btw I tried Arcbound + Khali yesterday and feel quite good, but have to say I have a better team to steamroll that game so I'm not sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
residente Posted January 23, 2013 Report Share Posted January 23, 2013 umm...will try your suggestion, just afraid I will not have enough dmg output when building this, and it's really expensive btw I tried Arcbound + Khali yesterday and feel quite good, but have to say I have a better team to steamroll that game so I'm not sure well ofc shadowmourne is pretty expensive, it should be your 5 or 6 item imo, but his dmg output is retardly higher than arcbound's dmg output, it still give you weapon speed crits and move speed, in a minor amount, yes, but the shadow will be so helpful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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