Muto Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 Feral.Terminus with an Intel build does ludicrous damage with his ultimate. Feral.Terminus is effectively doing (assuming intel of 500) [70+500(0.2)]x5 (remember that his ultimate hits the target 5 times a second) , or 850 damage a second in an AOE around him every second. After factoring in time scale, this is damage is close to a 1000 per second. if they use a Yomato Reactor and/or Masume it is substantially higher. I personally have tested this against 10k HP obselisk and managed to burn them down in approximately 10 seconds. Using Yomato and Masume I could lower this to just under 5 seconds. While one could stack into spell resist (assuming that you didn't have to worry about other heroes) it still would not be enough to negate the massive damage output by his ultimate alone. This is enough to cripple even strength heroes and bring them down in a matter of a few seconds, all the while Terminus can remain out of range by running or stealth using his passive. Other problems with his ultimate: -Stuns/silences do NOT cancel the effect. -His ultimate covers a MASSIVE area -End game his energy regen is HIGHER then the cost of canceling the ability so he never has to turn it off. Mathematically his Ultimate does WAY to much damage, and by end game can be cast indefinitely without any consequences. I highly suggest limiting the amount of time he can cast his ultimate and adding a cool-down to it. Qlx 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VasyaKot Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 Terminus will be nerfed in the next patch just like the other new heroes, so dont worry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 It's not the ultimate that bothers me about him, it's his insane laning strength. The only hero I could imagine keeping up on creeps in the hands of average players would be unix. He is untouchable when burrowed, and deals substantial damage. It's like v4-v5 Zeratul backstabs, except lasting longer, and AoE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VasyaKot Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 I love laning vs terminus because he stupidly burrows and becomes super easy target for skillshots, includin raynor silence, boros bola, drakes lance etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironsights Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 That damage isn't really that bad... I mean, with AA heroes if the cant blast an obelisk in 5 seconds or less I assume the build is poor and try a different one. Even with tank heroes, who aer supposed to be more durable than offensive, taking out obs in ten seconds is pretty reasonable. I have fought against numerous Ferals (go figure) and while his unlimited free cloaking is somewhat burdonsome early, e becomes less and less of an issue as the game goes on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aellectris Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 Buy a truesight ward... xNOVAxPRIMEx, Yaldi, Rem and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurricane Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 Buy a truesight, have a lane partner.. He's totally void after Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoWaterJustIce Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 Rancor w/ any hero rapes lurker hard :) and a good micro/boros/drake can just move lurker xNOVAxPRIMEx 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironsights Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 One thing to keep in mind, lurker's attack originates where he is. Thus if you haev any kind of an area affecting attack, you can target the lurker without having to "see" him. As drake, I abused this to no end. Unix-fungals work. I imagine boros bola/spell shields would do their thing...there are ways to hurt the lurker. Not sayign he isn't obnoxious to deal with, jsut saying he CAN be dealt with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qlx Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 Just nerf his R and He's fine. Smaller area, more energy, less damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hogwarts Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 one more we have kids crying OP OP OP instead of actually looking at the situation and seeing how to counter a hero, In the IH community we find lurker to be a bit on the weak side, while he has strong potential he is awkward and can really only do well in team fights if the enemy team ignores him, lurker at first glance looks to be op in the lane phase but when you actually look at it, he is mediocre at best , if he burrows and attacks you know right where he is, you can land all kinds of skill shots on him, many heroes counter lurker, if you have no skill shots you can buy the new item true sight ward, its a sentry ward that gives detection. or buy boundary scanners. Lurkers auto attack is extremely easy to dodge building him AA is almost all but useless unless you build a comp around it, like a lord z and such. We played around with the R in beta and its fine where its at, just play with the hero give it a chance, But must of all play reactive and dont get stuck in static builds that have no room for versatility every hero has a counter , then when your said static build fails come onto the forum and make op threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snacky Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 I think this new hero, is a first balanced, he is easy stop (drake, raynor, boros, etc...), but in late game really not have more damage (spell), he cant kill 1 vs 1 for example but he he atacck more target, i think is normal hero. Not OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muto Posted January 12, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 Its beyond me why so many people are telling me to get truesight or skillshot him when my post had nothing to do with his heroic Passive. I was not complaining about his ability to stealth early on, i was complaining about his ultimate's unlimited 1-2k damage a second AOE late game. Most Good INT build Lurkers won't even borrow late game (quite understandably) and will just rely on the ultimate to burn down all opposition while running around at 5+ movespeed do to timescale. Had he needed to be borrowed to cast his ultimate I never would have complained. Please read the post before responding. The entire point of this post was that both mathematically and in practice his ultimate does far more damage then that of all other heroes within a few seconds and he can keep it activated forever. Please name one other hero that late game has a permanent, non-stop 850+(up too 2.5k with timescale and item bonuses) Damage a second AOE around him and I'll be glad to concede that he isn't OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironsights Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 Its beyond me why so many people are telling me to get truesight or skillshot him when my post had nothing to do with his heroic Passive. I was not complaining about his ability to stealth early on, i was complaining about his ultimate's unlimited 1-2k damage a second AOE late game. Most Good INT build Lurkers won't even borrow late game (quite understandably) and will just rely on the ultimate to burn down all opposition while running around at 5+ movespeed do to timescale. Had he needed to be borrowed to cast his ultimate I never would have complained. Please read the post before responding. The entire point of this post was that both mathematically and in practice his ultimate does far more damage then that of all other heroes within a few seconds and he can keep it activated forever. Please name one other hero that late game has a permanent, non-stop 850+(up too 2.5k with timescale and item bonuses) Damage a second AOE around him and I'll be glad to concede that he isn't OP. I can agree with this...all his skills/spells should end when he is above ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itsthatguy Posted January 12, 2013 Report Share Posted January 12, 2013 You can indirectly kill true sight wards, by using ur AA as splash, positioning yourself to hit it :D He kills lanes so fast. I got to the point with Explosive and lightning rod (At level 10) where i can kill an entire passing wave and they all died before they ran past out of my range. Lols Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FruitNinja Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 -Stuns/silences do NOT cancel the effect. It's not channeled, so I'm pretty sure this tidbit is intended. -End game his energy regen is HIGHER then the cost of canceling the ability so he never has to turn it off. Yeah this is a problem... EDIT: Didn't read most of the thread. Wasn't surprised to see hogwarts ranting again. It is definitely true that his damage potential is high despite how it can be migitated. If lurker really is weak in ih's, then I suppose he is just another pubstomp hero like shadow and boros. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rem Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 its not channeled, so it shouldn't be occurring while stunned/silenced. Hes casting it each second for twenty mana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FruitNinja Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 its not channeled, so it shouldn't be occurring while stunned/silenced. Hes casting it each second for twenty mana It's a behavior. This is not a bug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rem Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 Its an auto casting spell with a 1 second cooldown like a priests heal in wc3 (Or at least thats how it should operate) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamescossey Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 it says it hits the target 5 times but ive been vs a rancor. both intel build, it took about 10 seconds to kill him. basically i think his ulti hits random spots but when it hits it does damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muto Posted January 13, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 it says it hits the target 5 times but ive been vs a rancor. both intel build, it took about 10 seconds to kill him. basically i think his ulti hits random spots but when it hits it does damage. I've seen it do damage consistently to people not getting struck by the actual tentacles, so this is not the case in my experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamescossey Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 by the way i find AA build on lurker better if ur team has a boros, drake, micro, or brine. 2 even better. i was full AA build with time spliter, FOE and retrofit for the slows. then pyre and lightning rod and darwin might. they would toss someone to me, id stun them and AA them down. not as good as vespus with those items but works well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 haha james i was boros in that game bolaing em to u and u are right it works really well. Anyways i have played lurker late game and his ulti does go all over the place for me i have had a few people escape from me just because my ulti would get creeps and such Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gitch Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 At first I thought the same as op but then after actually playing a few games I realised he is really quite weak. Sure on paper he can do 3kdps aoe but in practise that will never happen because there will always be creeps soaking up damage and you can't time the timescale buff perfectly, etc. In fact I find that any aa hero with leach will tend to heal faster than lurker can damage them. If I would change anything I would let his heal skill work on heroes. Whilst he can clear creeps very well he is poor at pushing towers because he has no escape and is especially vulnerable to initiation like bola & lance, which puts him behind the likes unix and bio who can push both creeps and towers effectively. He also has so many natural counters so if you are having trouble then just play drake, cyprus, balrog, lz, nova, shadow, zera etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironsights Posted January 13, 2013 Report Share Posted January 13, 2013 lurker alone is annoying but not over powered. there are some combos though, such as roach lurker, that are damn near impossible to lane against. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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