Biotron Tyrannitus Putrify(ulti)

[LOLLMAO]

Why exactly is biotron's ulti less useful than any of his other moves?

The ultimate can be countered via many methods...

 

1. Getting armour (weakens biotron's civilians physical damage) or raw health (to survive the duration)

 

2. Getting SHM/sharpnel shuts the civilians temporarily

 

3. Any blink/SHC/warpshard/impact dial

 

4. Most AOE spells

 

5. Cloaking out of truesight holder and avoid scans

 

The only thing biotron's ultimate can do is kill heroes with lack of AOE/blink/cloak or slow the opponent for <5-10 seconds.

Can this really be considered an ultimate?

Note: There are more counters like lockbox, taser, teamwork but then those counter many heroes ultimates so those

don't really count.

[Takeray]

It was buffed last patch. ( increasing more amplified phys damage).

 

This is an important path usually not read, I see Bio more as Tank/supp/annoying more than a killer except if you fill a caster role ( you have a guide here) but not tested so I can't give my opinion.

 

It forces enemy to concentrate on minions just a few seconds, it creates a bit of nerviosisn and that's all. If you ask me he as killer vs not bad players. I think no.

[Itsthatguy]

My issue with biotrons Minions is that they can die as they spawn. I think that Biotron minions should have 70% Spell and Physical Resistance for the first 3 seconds when they spawn. Then it goes back down to 0%. Makes it so that they don't instantly die before they even get 1 hit down, but also killable after they can get a hit down. Heroes like mandrake can actually kill all the civilians sometimes before they even spawn (Since they take 1.5 seconds to unburrow from the ground)

 

I mean the only hero i can even kill with it is Fine Brine. Raynor can survive most the time now too... (And raynor is like the hero who is ultimately countered by biotrons ultra).

[Ironsights]

I look at bio's ulti more as a deadly removal option than a killing attack.

 

Team fight starts, bio ulti's the carry and (assuming he has an axe) begins to attack it. Carry either runs for the duration of the ulti, allowing his team to die and allowing yourside to win the fight, or he stands and fights with the minions eating his face....and dies.

 

The spell forces you to choose between taking heavy damage or running away. And if launched as a finisher, can be beastly because you can't always run from it. Plus, the damage amplification it provides leaves you oh so vulnerable to being finished off.

 

Bio is not the lurking death machine he once was, but honestly, is that a bad thing?

[Rem]

His ulti does need a buff though.... You skipped the third option, where carry has an explosive retrofit and continues raping bios face all minions dying as they aproach, and or friendly spellcaster, rancor or whoever drops an aoe on carry instantly annihilating spawn.

[neogeo]

one time you saw nearly every pub-game a biotron. because he got with his begin of lvl 6 his instakills and get tanky and much money from this early "farming" on heroes.

[rayn]

the glory of bio ended for me with the patch that nerfed the timescale buff on his W.

 

praise the glory times ... ~.~

[neogeo]

the glory of bio ended for me with the patch that nerfed the timescale buff on his W.

 

praise the glory times ... ~.~

 

the glory of playing a overpowered game on your side? in this "glory time" you see nearly every pub-game a bio - why?

[Ironsights]

get the overlord talent.

 

it provides damage resists to nearby non-hero's...such as creeps or bio's minions.

 

Now they can survive a hit from the AOE

[Qlx]

I think the first thing that needs to be buffed is their movement speed.

Swiftness (+8% Mvmt.) and a Phantom Menace and maybe a Seperated Cleaver and you can run from them, in circles if you want.

Lol...

[Hogwarts]

the glory of playing a overpowered game on your side? in this "glory time" you see nearly every pub-game a bio - why?

 

bio was strong hands down and needed a change but the he didnt need to be over nerfed like he was, he did not both need a increased in cd to his w and the time scale buff removed, and the minion nerf i dont know seems a little to strong of a nerf

[BestPlayer]

bio was strong hands down and needed a change but the he didnt need to be over nerfed like he was, he did not both need a increased in cd to his w and the time scale buff removed, and the minion nerf i dont know seems a little to strong of a nerf

 

No idea what you're trying to say, but I'm sure it is another noobish post from a bad player, like all of your posts.

[TungVu]

TOUCHE!!!!!!

[Hogwarts]

No idea what you're trying to say, but I'm sure it is another noobish post from a bad player, like all of your posts.

 

not sure what your problem with me is but hey i wish you the best luck in the future

[TungVu]

not sure what your problem with me is but hey i wish you the best luck in the future

 

so weak wtf?

Should have been: "flob u soed ur a shap nub player, what makes u think ur so good huh? News flash ur just some trash who thinks hes good when he doesn't even know the game anymore. What a complete ret4rd, ect."

 

Or just ethug him, it always does the trick.

[GhostEU]

Putrify is a very powerful ultimate, but interestingly, it is extremely deadly early game and mostly "lol" lategame.

 

What I think needs to happen to make it remain useful into the late game without overpowering early game is this:

 

Level 1: 400% ms, amplify as now

Level 2: 460% ms, amplify as now, Putrify-spawned civs have +50% HP

Level 3: 520% ms, amplify as now, Putrify-spawned civs have +100% HP

 

What this does is make it not a complete death sentence early on for most heroes and make Putrify still a bit more useful late game without the civs dying to someone sneezing. Note that for balance reasons the bonus HP only applies to Putrify spawned civs (which is 8 at start and then 1 per sec for the short duration) rather than all civs, which would make it too powerful.

[Doom]

I say the civillians slow movement speed by 50%, for 0.2 seconds. When you have a whole horde attacking you, it will be a permanent slow, unless you blink away/ DST/ etc.

[neogeo]

this op-bio time that was a time that broken the fun in pubs. this pub scrubs that only search for the "how next op hero i should play?" - i think they had a very fun time with him.

 

sometimes with his "-fruit" command pineapple - that showed on his ass, not head...

 

with the begin of level 6 in midlande he's waiting in his sunken grave... - waiting... probably the browser of the player is open, hes surfing and looking films and eating chips... because he need only two commands, when he had arrived his level 6 of GLORY...

 

(1) to come up and press one klick on mouse

(2) and one on keyboard to get his kill

 

go buy everytime this smoke screen and reserve for every damn ult a potion.

 

after nerf his use in pubs is like other chars.

[LOLLMAO]

Biotron was rightfully nerfed due to the immense scaling of his minions but that also makes his ulti weaker by a LOT. His other skills remain unaffected.

Biotron is still a very powerful killer if executed e and q (with every minion damage) and it rapes most non-tank heroes during early game.

It's just that Biotron's ulti seems even worse than his basic spells and it barely annoys most heroes (brine, raynor, rory might struggle a little)

 

The amplification on physical damage only works on casters as agi heroes have high armor due to 2-3 agility items making it less significant

due to high physical resist. Any tank with 1-3 armor/strength items can tank the entire duration.

There are many carries that also have AOE damage or similar that can avoid most damage/ kill most of bio's minions.

Some common examples are: shadow - q/w, toxi - q/e, erekul - q, kerri - aa, tychus - q/w/e, zera - heroic passive/e, voltron - q

 

Note: As for overlord talent, I really don't know if it works on minions as you can't click on them to see their buffs/debuffs/health.

The health and damage should probably scale more evenly to balance the threat of the ulti... like 20% str for damage and 15% maximum health.

[rayn]

simple solutions possible:

 

-give the ult back the silence (moss duration wouldnt hurt)

OR

-give w back the timescale so he can use his ult more often

[Itsthatguy]

Could make it so that Biotron Minions deal Spell Damage, But very very low Spell Damage (Or True), and have very high Hp. Then you can scale it so it usually deals a fixed amount of damage. The Issue with the ability is that the scaling on the damage can either deal 0% STR Physical damage from AoE, or up to 6000% STR Physical Damage. Like honestly, I've never seen such a massive difference. If you could make it so Biotron minions rarely die, but keep damage down, could modify it so it usually always does a certain amount of damage (Unless said player runs or uses a shrapnel to stop the attacking, then it makes it not overly counterable, but not OP by the fact there are less counters.)

 

The big issue is the scaling on the Minions.

 

Because it seems like Biotron's final either makes you Auto-die, or Tickles you.

[akanna]

His ult was just buffed in 1.67, it does not need more buffs. It is a cheap move that picks people off or sends them running from teamfights just like its always been.

 

Biotron.Tyrannitus

- Putrify Physical Damage Amplification increased to 20/30/40% from 10/20/30.

 

Yes there are counters, but those have always been there, and all ults should have counters. I win buttons are lame.

 

Scrolling through the thread it seems that most of the arguments here seem to center around the fact that "people can build to survive bio's ult so it obviously needs buffs"....But that mentality is all wrong because ults should not be a 1 click KO. We have far too many of those already and they just take the fun out of things...the game becomes a "who clicks R first" battle with no degree of skill or strategy. The most useful aspect of his ult is making 1 hero run from whatever fight you are in, whether or not they die is really a detail thing....Its also great for killing off / chasing away people that are hugging a tower.

 

You claim that it doesnt work on AA heros because they have higher armor, but if you think about it most AA heros do not have any natural AOE, and are usually the ones that have to take off running and abandon their team in a teamfight every time you ult until they are able to invest in some kind of reliable counter (which slows down their build). Taking a carry out of a teamfight is a huge deal even if they do somehow manage to survive, because your team can mop up the leftover players. And even if an AA does build to counter, It is very rare that all 5 players pack counters to bio, so you always have at least 1-2 easy targets all game. Plus you can counter most of their counters....

 

Try a taser to seal off all counters from your target for 5 seconds

Or a shrapnel so people cant attack the minions to save your target

 

Bios ult works just fine the way it is, if you start buffing minon speed or damage it will just be stupid OP and piss people off.

[Itsthatguy]

I've never seen biotrons useful in any team fight, unless you are the person you finaled already used all their abilities and is the last one left. I think biotron's final is the most counterable item in the game

 

Counters:

Warp Shard

Impact Dial

Dark Steel Titan

Super Heated Mantle

Shrapnel Cloak

Chilling Artifact

Phase Cloak

Explosive Retrofit

 

 

Any Cloaking Ability//Burrow

Any Slow

Any AoE Damager

Any Teleport

(Almost every hero in the game has one of these types of abilities or more. Brine and Raynor are like the only heroes without one)

 

The Issue about the counter is that you only need one person to get it to deny if Final. At least when your rory, an entire team has to get parallax, while if your biotron, you can get 1 item (or just ur skill) to deny his final.

 

80% of the time i see biotron use his final, His minions die within the first second (or sooner). It is the exact reason why I don't do Tank Biotron anymore if I'm trying to kill someone.

 

It is the reason why I'd like Biotron to do about a fixed amount of damage, because scaling difference purely on % makes it scale to differently. In this way it doesn't auto kill enemies instantly who have no armor and are squishy, but it also will damage heroes that can easily counter biotron's final.

 

Sure biotron can be useful in those 1v1 situations, but when it comes to a team battle, it is the least helpful skill majority of the time.

 

I just think it is wrong that Biotron's Final can deal either 0 Damage or 20000 damage [before armor] (You've seen what it can do to Daggoth).

[akanna]

^^ I think CAIN has the most counterable ult, bio minions still chase you after warp etc, cains missles derp and loose target lock ;)

 

As for the other stuff you said, whenever bio ults early-mid game, someone takes off running with a bunch of minions chasing them...thats just how it goes. Its not till mid-late game that people are able to burst the minions down, and even when they do you can take advantage of it pretty easily (if everyone is focused on the minions no one is targeting your team)

So for a good part of the game you are able to use his ult to either force someone away from a tower, or out of a teamfight

 

Obviously bios burrow and pop up anywhere move is his most useful move, it lets you cheat death left and right and harass people

But fighting wise bios ult is extremely strong for a large portion of the game

Its the only move in game that will literally chase you all the way back to your base

And its stupid easy for bio to pop up ult someone and pop away, picking off / chasing away anyone on demand even if they try to hug towers.

 

Late game wise, bio is more of an annoyance than a threat, but those minions can still pack a punch if you dont focus them down and they make a great distraction. Im not really sure what you could do to them late game that wouldnt make them OP in the mid game

If you think about it, all the minion heros loose steam in the late game for that same reason...

 

Honestly ive never really been a big fan of bio because he really doesn't do anything but burrow and ult, which is super boring, so i get what you mean about his contribution to teamfights outside of ulting...but I really dont see how buffing his ult would change that in the slightest. All of the existing counters will work no matter what kind of damage output the minions do, so in the end its all on you to keep people from being able to use those counters.

 

Edit:

Not gonna lie, most people find bio super annoying early to mid game bc his ult chases you away from laning, and auto kills off a lot of the slower heros (unless they have smokescreen) In pubs hes actually a very strong hero early to mid game bc 95% of people are either too dumb to get smokescreens, or run out of them (bc you cant stack them) while laning against him so he feeds most of the early - mid game like any other cloaked/burrowed hero.

[Jaysi]

simple solutions possible:

 

-give the ult back the silence (moss duration wouldnt hurt)

OR

-give w back the timescale so he can use his ult more often

 

Don't give the ultimate a silence. That would be way too easy for him. Just buy a taser and taser your target so they can't blink or do other spells, say they're an AA with explosive then buy a Shrapnel Cloak, to slow them to let the initial civs to catch up you can get FoE and AA them once or Nitrogen Retrofit and the Shrap will slow them. Is it fair he has to buy two items to get kills? Hell yeah if it dam near guarantees a kill. Just like how Grasshead's Unix always get's Impact and Taser to own targets with his egg and prolonged ultimate(I'm scared to play that guy with the recent buffs to Unix tbh...).

 

What the REAL nerf to Bio was his base weapon speed change. Use to be 1.6, now its 1.9. RIP AA Bio. Troll.