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Tassadar - Smart casting


Teucer
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Always fun to see tass in games, how about smart casting to make it easier for newer players.

 

He still retains his complexity, and old pros can still micro manage the hell out of him, but for basic situations it would be a lot simpler if we could just W,W / E,E / R,R on the group selection

 

Naturally this would be much more familiar to players of regular starcraft as well.

 

Can't think of a CON related to game play or balance.

 

If this thread/topic exists elsewhere, apologies. I did not do any research.

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This isn't smartcasting-- that's when you have a group of HT, tell them to storm and only one storms.

 

You want a special feature that is only possible if Tassadar's Clone is the same as Tassadar in terms of unit [which if it was then Tassadar's Clone could level and stuff].

As much as I'd love it, I don't think it's possible.

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Ah, I see what you mean now.

Consider however that if you select a group of marauders and marines, and press stim, they will both stim. This also works in custom maps with like 6 different unit types, all stimming, and even using similar ability classes bound to the same hotkey when you use the stim command. So, this must be possible.

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What do you mean by smart casting?

 

If you mean the smart-casting in LoL then no there is no easy way to do that.

 

 

No, in lol it is when you cast an abilty only using a button

 

 

For example R + click hero with raynor

 

with smartcasting it is R with mouse over enemy ( not ckiling).

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No matter what tab opens leaderboard, fruitninja

 

It's just "Hold to see" versus "Toggle"

 

Yes, but lag makes it so that tapping the button doesn't even show it. :)

 

No, in lol it is when you cast an abilty only using a button

 

 

For example R + click hero with raynor

 

with smartcasting it is R with mouse over enemy ( not ckiling).

then no there is no easy way to do that.
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This is a game that requires skill. Timing, positioning, build orders, etc. all contribute to a relatively cerebral experience. Removal of a mechanic that requires skill like spell selection and clicking on a specific hero to cast, would dilute and simplify a satisfying achievement.

 

Some hero's require more skill to be successful with. So practice to improve or choose another, easier hero. I prefer to challenge myself to succeed with more complex or micro intestive heros. It is that much more satisfying when u excel.

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Actually, making a hero intentionally tedious to use is just artificial difficulty and shouldn't be in a game. Not sure if that's what you're suggesting, though. Hopefully not.

 

I think what the OP is suggesting is to make it so that Tass' abilities on both tassadars can be used without switching manually. The problem is that the only way to do this would, afaik, make it impossible to pick which tassadar you want to cast with, thus making him extremely risky and unpredictable. While unpredictability is Tassadar's focus, this is not the way to do it. :)

 

Tassadar is pretty much in a state where the game engine is already at the best it can get, short of a rework of his skills.

Tass in his present state will never be a hero that people with low APM can play at his full potential. He's just not designed to be straightforward and simple to use because of the possibilities within his playstyle. There are too many questions to ask such as whether or not to keep draining or to attack (draining is a good way, for example, to buy time until the next Q for a clutch kill), whether to swap or not to swap, which way to start running after you swap yourself with your ally in an effort to save them, etc. Even if you make casting easier, you need to be able to time them and execute everything properly, so it wouldn't help much with making him accessible.

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I think what the OP is suggesting is to make it so that Tass' abilities on both tassadars can be used without switching manually. The problem is that the only way to do this would, afaik, make it impossible to pick which tassadar you want to cast with, thus making him extremely risky and unpredictable. While unpredictability is Tassadar's focus, this is not the way to do it. :)

 

As is the case with Starcraft matches, smart casting as it stands...the closer of the two goes first all else being equal, thus making him NOT risky and NOT unpredictable. Its quite simple

 

I'm suggesting that if both are selected, you need only press E twice to trigger that ability on both, or press W and select a target (as i would with a group of high templar using feedback ) to trigger the ability on either tass in the group based on smart casting rules. This does not NEGATE any of the complexity or skill that other replies referenced, it simply puts it BEHIND smart casting, so to speak, in that if you don't care to make a selection, you may depend on smart casting, but if you do care, then of course this being introduced would not impede that in any way and you could still micro, and in many situation would NEED to micro the projection vs the original.

 

As to everyone suggesting TAB, well just using 1 and 2 works, and only requires 1 or 2 more buttons be pressed per action (depending on your current selection) then smart casting.

 

The only sensibile arguments I can imagine against having this in place is performance (as I'm not aware what if any exposure blizzard grants custom maps into this feature/api) and simple time, developers of this game have better things to do, which is perhaps the reason behind any number of decisions (speculation on my part), such as raynor's marauders not being selectable via '3' etc...

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As is the case with Starcraft matches, smart casting as it stands...the closer of the two goes first all else being equal, thus making him NOT risky and NOT unpredictable. Its quite simple

 

Well that's worthless.

 

There are two Tassadars. The way you're describing it, it sounds like you're making it harder to use the farther Tassadar to do things like swaps. You want to swap with the longer distance, not the shorter distance, in a lot of cases... What if you want to swap then attack a person? Normally you make sure you have the farther Tassadar selected, then R+click, then right-click. With your method I would have to press a number, then R+click, then 3, then right click.

 

Really, the only thing you'd ever use this for is the shields, which are untargetable, since Soul Drain doesn't stack afaik.

Remaking Tassadar's clone system is a waste of time for just this.

 

The only sensibile arguments I can imagine against having this in place is performance (as I'm not aware what if any exposure blizzard grants custom maps into this feature/api) and simple time, developers of this game have better things to do, which is perhaps the reason behind any number of decisions (speculation on my part), such as raynor's marauders not being selectable via '3' etc...

 

 

Well since you're obviously biased, what if Tassadar's clone is a different unit? Smartcasting will not work in the current setup because if it's disabled, then BOTH UNITS will attack with one cast. Since that's not how it happens, simply ticking the "best unit" flag in the editor will not do anything.

 

Try learning how the editor works before you post like this. You admit that you're not aware if blizzard lets custom maps use this "api." Well, if you've ever touched the editor you'd know that there is a "best unit" flag that enables this, but it only works when both units are the same like I said.

 

 

I think using aliases could work, but it might remove tab functionality as well.

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Try learning how the editor works before you post like this. You admit that you're not aware if blizzard lets custom maps use this "api." Well, if you've ever touched the editor you'd know that there is a "best unit" flag that enables this, but it only works when both units are the same like I said.

 

Great, a sensible reason not to add it. Case closed. Now i know.

 

--- (the rest no longer seems relevant)

 

Pretty sure Soul Drain stacks, at the least projection and original will both do damage if the slow doesn't, so there is cause to use that at the same time. Likewise, since being swapped doesn't clear your target you could also use it for swapping.

 

Also the addition of smart casting does not in any way inhibit a player from selecting the Tass they want to get the farther one, closer one, projection, original, or whatever, it just means that in situations where you don't care or you want smart casting (best unit?) rules to apply, then you can rely on those.

 

Again, this was proposed to take a behavior familiar to new players and add it to the game for their benefit. Thats all i was suggesting, noting that if it was simply too much trouble to get the best unit flag to work, then I'm sure there are better things to be done with that time.

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Right. Make the game more easier ... That's what we need . Why isit so hard to click on ur clone , R E W click on ur non-clone , E Q W R and click on ur clone again. I play tassadar with no control groups since my inventory is 1 2 3 4 5 6 . Practice makes perfect , just cause you hate a hard hero to play , doesnt mean you have to make it easy , u want a easy hero go shadow . There's a freaking reason why he is labelled [Easy] DPS .

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I think new players shouldn't be trying Tassadar out, they should be using Tychus, Dustin, Nova, etc. Ones with simple mechanics so that they can focus on item builds, map awareness, and positioning.

 

Misuari, you're not helping...

Teucer had a legitimate suggestion, he just didn't seem to be aware of the problems with the game engine and how selection would work. I disagreed with his presentation ("there is no sensible argument..." etc).

Quality-of-Life improvements are always a good thing. That is why Tosh has his stun hotkeyed to W. It removes artificial barriers to allow actual positioning knowledge to be the deciding factor in games. But I think tosh is overpowered sooo maybe making him harder to use would counterbalance that... but it's still not a legitimate way to balance the game.

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For example a Fast sequence I do is E Tab E-R-W tab W. Only issue getting both selected is if you cast W with one then you command A ( Cause you want other attacking being a bit far), Drain will stop and you need a bit micro to only select one.

 

Despite of this no problem

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I think new players shouldn't be trying Tassadar out, they should be using Tychus, Dustin, Nova, etc. Ones with simple mechanics so that they can focus on item builds, map awareness, and positioning.

 

Misuari, you're not helping...

Teucer had a legitimate suggestion, he just didn't seem to be aware of the problems with the game engine and how selection would work. I disagreed with his presentation ("there is no sensible argument..." etc).

Quality-of-Life improvements are always a good thing. That is why Tosh has his stun hotkeyed to W. It removes artificial barriers to allow actual positioning knowledge to be the deciding factor in games. But I think tosh is overpowered sooo maybe making him harder to use would counterbalance that... but it's still not a legitimate way to balance the game.

Pardon me if it ticks me off when new players can't read [Hard]DPS and whine that it is hard and whine to make it a easier hero to use.

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