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Zeratul's Ultimate OP [v1.50]


Muto

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For quite a few games now I've seen the outcome of a game based purely on which team had a Zeratul. His ultimate has several problems with it that make him an almost unstoppable hero late game in most games. It allows him to drop a 5 second AOE stun late game with only a 45 second CD, during which he can either run or easily kill even strength heroes (especially with the new weapon speed cap) . Because of leech items, even things such as plating fail to stop him from killing any hero of his choosing. This paired with his high movement speed and ability to flip out of any conflict makes him practically invincible late game and impossible to counter (if played well).

 

While I find the 5 second stun a little overkill, I could get over it if his ultimate was not on such a short CD.

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For quite a few games now I've seen the outcome of a game based purely on which team had a Zeratul. His ultimate has several problems with it that make him an almost unstoppable hero late game in most games. It allows him to drop a 5 second AOE stun late game with only a 45 second CD, during which he can either run or easily kill even strength heroes (especially with the new weapon speed cap) . Because of leech items, even things such as plating fail to stop him from killing any hero of his choosing. This paired with his high movement speed and ability to flip out of any conflict makes him practically invincible late game and impossible to counter (if played well).

 

While I find the 5 second stun a little overkill, I could get over it if his ultimate was not on such a short CD.

I entirely agree with this. But notice that the new AA cap isn't the only thing at fault. The final got MASSIVELY buffed. The stun is not 5 seconds, but actually 6 seconds (1 second can be 3 extra hits and an extra 2000 damage if you think thats nothing). The cool down is 80 which is very lower (Same as Cyprus's Final). and its lowered timescale was originally 80% to now is 95%. The extra 15% makes a Massive difference, If you take that from 80%, it is causing the enemy to slow about an extra 75% of its original slow, nearly doubling the amount of slow going on. (It would be similar to being slowed by Tychus's Oil [watever its called] grenade and be in the old Zeratul final if you can't think of anything. Either way, its nearly a stun. A person with a movement speed of 4 (About standard) will have a movement speed of 0.16 in zeratuls new final. This makes nearly any speed buff worthelss in zeratuls final unless you were caught on the exact border, OR if your tosh with fixed movement speed. Overall, This final and with the new AA cap is actually STRONGER than when zeratul was broken with time stopping at 10000%, since with this final, you can get nearly DOUBLE the amount of hits down.

 

I played about 3 games with zeratul in pub, and dominated (Zeratul is not my main, in fact i don't play AA heros often, altho I'm fairly good at trying to copy what I see very good zeratul players do). It wasn't really a contest, and the fact that Haste just total dominates with zeratul and his final, Enemies have almost no chance. In my experiance, zeratul dominated before the AA patch, and all the other patch.

 

Finally, If zeratul wasn't powerful enough, I believe there is a glitch with him. Upon recieving a Kill with phase strike ALONE (Meaning not the strike right after phase strike), you will recieve bonus money (Its either money equal to what nova gains for Silent Takedown OR its around 90% of what the creep gives you. Something like that. I noticed that each creep kill, it popped up the mineral sign saying both +19 +17 minerals and i think a thor said +85 and +78 [Or 17] minerals. something like that

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No one is as OP as tosh with his ulti, so who cares lol

Seriously, I played 3 games with tosh against a team with a good fed zera (the three games they were outnumbered by something like 2 players), and I was still able to solo him or even take down 2 or 3 people at once with my ulti, so I would worry more about tosh than zera :P

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For quite a few games now I've seen the outcome of a game based purely on which team had a Zeratul. His ultimate has several problems with it that make him an almost unstoppable hero late game in most games. It allows him to drop a 5 second AOE stun late game with only a 45 second CD, during which he can either run or easily kill even strength heroes (especially with the new weapon speed cap) . Because of leech items, even things such as plating fail to stop him from killing any hero of his choosing. This paired with his high movement speed and ability to flip out of any conflict makes him practically invincible late game and impossible to counter (if played well).

 

While I find the 5 second stun a little overkill, I could get over it if his ultimate was not on such a short CD.

 

You complain about an ult who reduce time 90% when in 5v it was 1000% or it was 10000%?

 

It was funny, you could get HoM and ult everyone at lvl 6, they couldnt scape because HoN gave +100% weapon speed lol

 

 

@OP, Nova can 2 shot Zeratul at the speed of light, if Zeratul bubble, you always can have a "support" hero with, as WhaleTits said, a lockbox, sharpnel, impact dial, or just a hero with a stun, is difficult for Zeratul to bubble an entire team.

 

I can only agree that only Vorpal with massive tanky items can leave this ultimate alive, I dont know if any other hero can do that when Zeratul is fully geared

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Lets see, how to stop zeras ult... vorpal surging through it totally screws it up for zera, his surge slows down to the appropriate time scale and zera along with everyone else in it is caught in the slow motion surge so zera cant do anything, any stun from outside, such as rancors snipe, shc w/e. Lockbox on a hero who hangs back as was suggested, keeping an AA ranged hero such as nova or darpa behind so they dont get caught in it, their range is enough they can hit nearly the entire bubble from anywhere. Shadows vortex, kind of amusing to see a zera ulti vortexed it looks funny :D. Cow can save his allies with a well placed wall, the list goes on, but hes not nearly as scary as the ranged AA's these days hes so much easier to deal with unless your stuck in a 1v1 then your pretty much SOL

 

 

Oh yeah I pretty much think zera auto wins too whenever his ulti crashes the game now :c

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You complain about an ult who reduce time 90% when in 5v it was 1000% or it was 10000%?

 

It was funny, you could get HoM and ult everyone at lvl 6, they couldnt scape because HoN gave +100% weapon speed lol

 

 

@OP, Nova can 2 shot Zeratul at the speed of light, if Zeratul bubble, you always can have a "support" hero with, as WhaleTits said, a lockbox, sharpnel, impact dial, or just a hero with a stun, is difficult for Zeratul to bubble an entire team.

 

I can only agree that only Vorpal with massive tanky items can leave this ultimate alive, I dont know if any other hero can do that when Zeratul is fully geared

 

Unforchately, zeratul can nearly 2 shot heros too, and alot of the time its not enough enough.

 

In my opinion it is worst than the other version.

 

Few corrections tho: The time loss is 95% not 90% (that 5% may not seem a big deal but its actually a 50% Difference).

It lasts longer, the patch extended the duration of the final to 6 seconds.

AA Cap speed has been extended (increasing amount of hits you will get in final by about 30%),

There is a talent that grants +50% Attack speed and movement Speed making ultimate not an issue to kill someone.

 

Issue with the heros is that, it completely relys on you having specific heros or being screwed. The items have limits since majority of the time if someone targets someone, they isolate them (from far distance), or final on a group of people who clump together.

Majority of the time, it seems that a way you stop an enemy zeratul, is that you just either mass burst him before he can even react, OR he places down a poor final.

 

Each time i played Zeratul i had 80% of the kills from my team, (roughly about 15 kills and a few deaths from just kamakazie jumps). It just seems lame that this ability makes you completely reliant on your teammates have a certain ability at the perfect timing and having to cast it within a second or so. Zeratul attack speed can max out at 0.35 Roughly about 18 attacks? 90% their max hp 1800% Weapon damage, (Not to mention if you have crit), and if back stab, 1080% agi as spell damage (This is worst case scenario). The fact that zeratul can also target a specific person in a large group (Occasionally boros jumps). Zeratul just seems over powered, and its very easy to get stuck into the Sphere by accident, and if you do, its very hard to get out. (I have finaled a Raynor, just barely in my orb, 70% his body was actually out side my orb yet he barely moved [He was moving] and was in final entire time).

Anyways, my point is that zeratul seems rather over powered.

 

Unforchantely, Zeratuls usually target the enemy that will counter him =/. You may say, oh get a counter towards him, or Range heros will stop him. Don't forget he has teammates that can do the exact same thing (most likely on the other side) which will most likely end of finish or killing the enemy in the sphere if the zeratul is some way "Killed in Action". It seems like the counter towards him, is the get the a team to get counters towards him, which will cripple them towards the other teammates. (Not to mention that pubs cant function this well).

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Yup, hero OP, but at least still require basic voiding skill, so the average pubber can't perform with him as well as with Boros or Shadow. Inhouses have the skill needed to somewhat counter zera. The problem then lies with the really good pubbers who are just way better than their competetion with normal heroes, let alone zera.

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Yah no idea why they buffed Zera. Last game I played with Zera in 1.47 I went 22-0 with only 3 players on my team against a premade group of players who I have seen pubstomping many times. I build Zera much different than most people, but that is besides the point as it is really hard to argue he was an underpowered hero in need of a buff.

 

The combined 500% weapon speed cap now with his increased ultimate duration is just really lame now as once he gets farmed he can just use a variety of means of getting close to a target, ulting, then killing them no matter how much armor or health or spell resist you have.

 

I think a lot of inhausers (whose opinions are the only ones that seem to matter with regards to balance concerns) thought he was a bad hero and underpowered because they didn't know how to play him in a way other than phase strike, ult, and then hope you kill something and when it didn't work out for them they complained he was underpowered because he couldn't get a reliable cheese kill every time. Now I suppose they whined hard enough to give him the ability to cheese kill again and the Zera only players are now happy because he is back to being a skillless hero again.

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i destroyed zera with the new crackling. When cracklings ult is up he can run out of zeras ult pretty funny to watch.

 

That is like saying you destroyed Shadow by omnismashing with Boros. Crackling is one of the most OP heroes so far and I am extremely surprised he has not been hit harder with the nerf stick. His ultimate in particular is probably the most ridiculous thing I have seen in a long time that makes Leo now look like an utterly terrible hero in comparison.

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don't taze me bro

 

also have one designated person with either lockbox or shrapnel cloak, who waits until zera ults before joining the team fight.

 

*king atem voice* i activate chronosphere

*cool kid* you activated my trap card lockbox

*king atem voice* your trap activated my trap, ally quickly mossberg him before he lockboxes me.

*cool kid* you activated my trap as well, other guy quickly mossberg him before his mossbergs me so i can lockbox the zeratul.

 

*End yugioh troll sequence*

Positioning wins sadly. If you need a disruption item that is both position and ally reliant to stop something that leads to certain death then it probably is too strong. zera gets extra as/damage/movement from the attack masteries, zeal, and utility with a lot longer ulti time to couple with the death of observers. It seems like everything has been working in his favor.

 

Theres only one thing you can say now when you catch a guy in the bubble.... ZERATUL OBLIIIIITERATE

 

@ owl, thats the noooob zera way that the three man teams have to use when people rq giving them the leaver bonus. There is the c-c-combo zeratul who goes in with his ulti for large aoe dealer like rory, rancor or my personal favorite kerrigan. The problem was that smart people would rape him in lane by buying observers which made him useless. Now.... you better rape him in laning phase to stand a chance... raynor anyone?

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in the previous version zera was really weak.

since the boots are out from the game and the wepon speed gets a nerf in that version - it would get harder for him to get a good dps early, be effective like other chars - and he gets a support flavor, that can bring you team in big danger when you use your skills wrong.

 

with you level 6 ult and a bio with level 6 ult. bio can kill you with truesight. zera with bubble can get one or two hits on him in bubble - and he dont care about through his tankyness.

 

the level 6 ult only for last hitting. you make you ult and the enemy flys in the bubble - and you run one hour in the bubble to hit the target one time. in the 3 sec - you get one or two hit. the level 11 ult had the same character. only to level 16 with good farm, and assists you can begin to be a "zeratul". to this time 40 minutes in the game is over. thats the reason why he was more boring early and midgame. when you saw a bio - he gets early more effective.

 

now, not zera is op imo - the chances for dps chars makes him strong. nova can 2 shot and shes pretty easy to play. i see a darpa that gets 35 kills through his silence and hard dps output.. all dps chars now strong.

 

i remember the peoples cried for "why zeratul so weak early and mid?". now he gets a buff - now they cry - "why hes so strong - opopop?" i dont understand this.

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Before this patch, me, and any competent player I know would singlehandedly rape everything, including IHs (unless other team had boros player of equal caliber). Now new users with barely positive kdr and wlr, and rating are stomping everyone and everything. I do not know what moron called him UP before, but they were hugely moronic indeed.

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Before he was a bit up, because until you get to the point where you can easily pick out heroes, the game was nearly over in a competitive game.

Personally I had changed his ulti to 4s at lvl 1, because it was only usable to get last hit or for escaping.

That he rapes nearly everything now is, again, only due to crits.

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Zeratul ultimate can be countered by alpha just remember that. And also Zeratul is a character I don't ever use so I don't know much about him.

 

A hero that can travel around his ultimate dont mean he is the "counter" LOL

 

Zeratul counters are any hero with a stun or a powerful nuke, if they are out of the bubble, Rancor, Raynor, Cyprus, any hero with impact dial or lockbox, but crackling? noooo, he still attack at 5% weapon speed

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Well, my problem with the change to Zera is that the duration AND effect of the ult was changed, I was for either, but not both. Before, you could move around in it to an extent, which was making zera more balanced, but now, you can't really move, nor is it possible to wait it out, so either reduce the amount of time reduction, or reduce the duration, I would prefer the duration and increase the time reduction to a higher percentage, say maybe 100%? Or, just leave it where it was (80% unless I'm mistaken) and have the duration set to what it is now. To sum it all up, 2 rights make a wrong :P

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While I agree that the Zeratul buff makes him slightly OP, I've found that there is still counters to him. Dial is the best.. stay back in a team fight and hit your ally stuck in the bubble with it when Zera uses his ult. I think that the incoming changes to crits (making them deal physical dmg, not true) will make zera a fair hero again. Once this is in affect, Zera will not be able to kill any hero at will... all you get is armor.

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To be honest, zeratul is the only hero who's extremely OP now. AA heroes are fine in terms of damage output, but Zeratul's ult has a huge AoE and lets him kill tanks before the duration ends.

 

Now say instead of tanks you have 3 squishies...

 

gg.

 

It's a little much. If it was much smaller then I'd be okay. But it's not balanced just because some heroes can go through it, it's legitimately annoying for anyone who can't.

 

tl:dr it's anti-fun as Zera can just sit there slashing away and the person affected can't really fight back at all.

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To be honest, zeratul is the only hero who's extremely OP now. AA heroes are fine in terms of damage output, but Zeratul's ult has a huge AoE and lets him kill tanks before the duration ends.

 

Now say instead of tanks you have 3 squishies...

 

gg.

 

It's a little much. If it was much smaller then I'd be okay. But it's not balanced just because some heroes can go through it, it's legitimately annoying for anyone who can't.

 

tl:dr it's anti-fun as Zera can just sit there slashing away and the person affected can't really fight back at all.

 

agreed.

 

Reduce bubble radius to that of Zyrkahn's ring.

 

Make it a skill shot, not an AOE "i win" button.

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